Get Me Doug Jones

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[00:00:40] Hi, this is Armin Schimmerman. I play Quark on Star Trek Deep Space Nine and you are listening to the biggest little show this side of the Gamma Quadrant. It's the Trek Geeks podcast with Dan Davidson and Bill Smith. You figure out who's who.

[00:01:50] Tonight, somebody said get me Doug Jones and by golly, we're gonna do just that. Good Thursday evening all and all. Welcome to Trek Geeks Thursday Night Geeks presented by Fansets. I'm Bill Smith alongside, well, you might not know this about him, but he's surprisingly good at bluegrass music to the point where some people call him Dan Joe. It's Dan Davidson. Hey buddy, what's going on?

[00:02:19] Okay, you warned me that you were gonna start something new. Wow, I didn't expect that. Hey buddy, good to see ya. It's good to be back here. Hope everyone's doing well and Doug Jones. That's awesome. Doug Jones! It's the Hug Man himself. We should say he returns to Trek Geeks. Yes. I think this is his third time? I think if we count Trek talks, it will be his third time. Yes, I believe so.

[00:02:48] I know he was on once before to talk about just himself in general and I think once to support the Discovery Blu-ray release maybe? I think so. And I think it was one of those times he was suffering from a really bad cold. Yes. I forget which time it was, but he's such a great guy. He really lights up the room wherever he goes. I'm so excited we get to talk to him about something that is well deserved and that is his own documentary. So I'm very excited.

[00:03:14] You know, it's amazing to think that, you know, somebody so humble, because let's face it, Doug is not only one of the most joyful people ever associated with Star Trek, but he's probably one of the most humble. Yeah. It's weird to think of somebody like him having a movie made about his life and his career and him being like, all right, let's do this. But I suppose we can get into that to some extent. We will. I think I have a feeling we will. Absolutely.

[00:03:42] Yeah. I have a feeling we will, too. Dan, obviously it's Thursday night. We got to say hello to the crew. Absolutely. Obviously Ross is in the house. He's like, what's up all? And Dan's like, it's got me a day. Let's go. Got me a day. Let's go. Get out of there. Dan, our good friend Jay Stopey is in the house saying it's 8 p.m. I was promised there'd be snacks. Dan's a snack right there. Look at him. Dan, grand love, 6, 7, 8, in the house for Thursday Night Geeks.

[00:04:12] My grand love. And of course, Jay says, hello. Burley is, of course, here for Thursday Night Geeks. Should be a great show. I think she overestimates us. Helen is here so Thursday night can actually start. Actually happen. It is now officially Thursday. Helen deems it so. Jim is in the house. What's up, Jim? Hey, Jim. Dan, our sister Tamiya is in the house. Hey, y'all. Are you going through puberty over there?

[00:04:41] Come on, girl. That was pretty good. That is really good. Michael will be out right now. There's a series of Hey Tamiya's in there. So we'll just assume everybody says, Hey Tamiya. Hey Tamiya. Hey Tamiya. Dan Joe. We got our first Dan Joe of the night. For the rest of the night, you will be known as Dan Joe. I'm okay with that. That's okay. Ryan's here. Grand love says, Hey you. Ed Milner is in the house. Ed, thank you for joining us tonight. He's looking forward to Doug. So are we.

[00:05:11] And James Young also in the house. James, thank you for showing up tonight for Thursday night geeks. Great to have everybody here. Dan and I, of course, are here as often as we can be on Thursday nights. Dan, the last time we were here was two weeks ago, right before I started my new job, which leads me to ask, what are you drinking? I went simple tonight. I was downstairs a little later than I usually would be. And I didn't really have time to prep anything.

[00:05:39] So I just poured myself a glass of dough boy cookie dough whiskey with a couple pieces of edible cookie dough in there. So I'm guessing the edible cookie dough, of course, wait, all cookie dough is edible, but I'm guessing the cookie dough was an aftermarket addition. An add-on, that is correct. You can actually buy bags of Ben and Jerry's cookie dough things. Really? Yeah.

[00:06:08] So I grab a bag and throw it in the freezer. And whenever I have some of this or a cookie dough martini, I throw one or two of them in there. How long has there been cookie dough whiskey? How long have I been sleeping on this? Not long. We came across it last year, maybe. I don't know if it's been a long longer than that, but when we were living in New Hampshire still, we drove out to Salem, New Hampshire one weekend because we wanted to get some biscotti liqueur for one of the martinis that I make.

[00:06:35] And while we were there, a representative from this company, Doughboy, was doing free samples. And I took a free sample and bought two bottles and I've been getting it ever since. Wow. Dan, of course, you were telling us about your drink. Wait, wrong one. Sci-Fi Sisters, of course, Yvette is in the house. Hey, Yvette. We've got two thirds of the Sci-Fi Sisters in the house with us tonight. I like that. We need one more to complete the set. That would be fantastic. What are you drinking, pal?

[00:07:02] Well, earlier I had a vodka lemonade, but right now I got water. Water. Yeah. Can I tell you that the traffic driving around Raleigh is horrendous? I do not doubt it. I do not doubt that. It's not Atlanta bad, but it's horrible. It's not Boston bad, though, right? No, I think it's actually in many ways worse than Boston. Really? I thought Boston was always one of the worst in the like... No. No, no, no.

[00:07:32] Okay. Not even close. Atlanta is by far the worst. Oh, okay. I remember driving to Lowell every day. It would routinely, you know, for a 45-minute drive, it would routinely take us an hour. At least. And the way home is usually worse. It depends, though, on what day. Because sometimes on the way back, it would be like 45 minutes on the way back. Yeah. It routinely takes me an hour and a half to get to drive 45 minutes each way.

[00:07:57] So I'm spending roughly three hours on the road every day, which is just sucking it right out of me. I do not like that at all. I do not miss that in the slightest. Sam, I am. My first 30 days have to be on site. Oh, yep. And then I go to a hybrid schedule, which I'm not thrilled about. What's the hybrid? What is it? Two or three days in? That's still under some debate. Yvette says, that is the look of a man traumatized. My sister, you have no idea.

[00:08:28] No idea. So that's what's new with me. How was Disney? Disney was good. I think that I psyched myself up for it too much. So if it wasn't 100% perfect, I was going to be disappointed. And I was disappointed because it was not 100% perfect. I will say we will always go to Disney. We are always Disney fans. I have talked to you about this before.

[00:08:55] The customer service and the expectations from Disney have fallen so far off the cliff in the last six or seven years that it's kind of sad. We had a couple of issues with problems that were completely avoidable if people didn't get their head out of their ass down there. But they didn't. So it was stressful a couple of times. But always great. The weather was perfect. It was in the 80s and 90s the whole week. We had one bout of rain for like 10 minutes on Saturday afternoon.

[00:09:26] We were supposed to go to a Spartan race on Saturday up in Tampa. And we decided not to. We're like, you know what? We're on vacation. We're not going to traumatize ourselves with doing a marathon or an obstacle course in the Florida heat. So we decided not to do it. And I'm glad that we did because I really just wanted to relax. Okay. Yeah. So back to work. And here we are. Thursday Night Geeks. Well, speaking of Thursday Night Geeks, this aforementioned show that we're on, what do you say we do this?

[00:09:56] Let's set the table. We'll do fan set spot right away. And then we'll make way for Doug. How does that sound? I love that idea. Uninterrupted Dougie hugginess. Dougie hugginess. All right. We'll be right back.

[00:10:25] Dan, of course, we're grateful to have fan sets as our presenting sponsor on Trek Geeks. The entire network, actually. Not just us, but Sci-Fi Sisters and Big Sci-Fi Podcast and Space Crime Continuum. And I got the name right. And well, I did. It's a miracle. But Dan, fan sets has been with us for 10 years, which means they are now 10 years old. They are. And we are so excited about them. And Lou doesn't look a day over 100. It's really amazing.

[00:10:54] I mean, he is an old fart. Let's be honest. That's okay, though. Yeah, it's great. It's always great to talk about them every single time we get behind these microphones. They are our presenting sponsor. We would have nobody else as our presenting sponsor. They have over 500 officially licensed Star Trek pins. New ones are coming out every month. We're going to talk about some new ones right now. But hey, guess what? Tomorrow's the 15th. So there's probably going to be even more new ones tomorrow. So look for those.

[00:11:20] But right now at their website, fansets.com, you can go and we're going to talk all Starfleet Academy right now. The first one we're going to talk about is the very cool Starfleet Academy Athena logo, which is kind of interesting that they call it that. I can see where it comes from with the kind of good look at the cells. Yeah, I'm digging it. I'm digging it. And next up, I absolutely love this one, dude. This has to be like real, like real somewhere.

[00:11:45] These awesome War College Mugato mascot logo pins are now available at fansets.com. I absolutely love that. I love the gold horn. That's pretty funny. And last but not least is the next in the ever expanding Starfleet Academy Delta line. It's the Cadet Operations Delta. And as always, it's available in pin and magnet form. And in case you didn't know this, buddy, you can get all of these beauties right now at a little place called fansets.com.

[00:12:15] You know, can I just say, I want to see this Mugato logo on like a hockey jersey. Wouldn't that be amazing? That would be awesome. I'm down for it. Let's do it. Even like a football helmet? Because, I mean, that would help me deal with you because I want to bang my head against a wall all the time. Okay. All right. I like that. Thank you. I appreciate that. I knew you'd get one in at some point and you didn't disappoint. Well, it's the story of my life. I typically don't disappoint because I'm just me.

[00:12:43] But yeah, so everybody, get all those pins. Get the Magato or the Gamato or the Mugatu. Mugatu. Or the Athena logo. I had to go back a page to see what they were again because I've already forgotten. Or the Operations Delta pin from Starfleet Academy. Get all of those in your cart. Get them. Just add to cart. Add to cart. Add to cart. And at checkout, Dan, be sure to use the special discount code TREKKEX. Oh, that's a good code. I know. Isn't it great? What happens when you use that code, Bill?

[00:13:13] Dan, you use that code. It's like all capital letters all together. No spaces. TREKKEX, you get 10% off your entire order. Get out. All right. No, you get 10% off your entire order. And it's not just the Star Trek pins. You could order anything. You could order accessories. Some of the other pin lines they've got. 10% off everything to get those pins in your hot little hands down. Fantastic. Fansetstastic. No.

[00:13:43] No. No? No. What happens if you spend more than $30, buddy? Oh, thank you for reminding me. Because, Dan, when you spend more than $30, do you know what happens? Free shipping. It's got a deal day. Let's get free shipping. Let's go. How old you get free shipping? You get free shipping. I love that. Free shipping from fansets.com. So spend $30. Get your stuff sent to you for free. Be happy. Love fansets. That's all I'm saying.

[00:14:13] Love it. I just love that. Fansets. Our pins have character. And we thank our friends at Fansets for being the presenting sponsor of Thursday Night Geeks.

[00:14:44] So, Bill and I are thrilled to welcome back an unbelievably wonderful human being to our little Trek geek universe. Not only is he just about the kindest human being on the planet, he just happens to be an Academy Award winner. And one of the most incredible creature actors in the entire world. For Star Trek fans, he's always going to be the one and only Saru from Star Trek Discovery. And he is the best damn convention hugger anywhere. Dare I say his name should be changed to Hug Jones. He's Doug Jones. Doug, welcome back.

[00:15:15] I really am just so excited that you're here. And we also want to welcome, sitting right next to you, the president of Cool Water Productions, Derek Mackey. We've had some great discussions with you over the years, Doug, in Vegas and at other conventions. We're psyched to have you here for the first time to tell us all about this amazing new project about Doug's life, to which you are the executive producer of. It's a documentary called Get Me Doug Jones. We can't wait to hear all about it. And welcome to the show, guys.

[00:15:44] Thank you so much for having us. That was an introduction I already have trouble living up to. I took Dan about a month and a half to write it. So one thing about the Academy Award. I don't have a statuette myself, but the Shape of Water did win Best Picture and we all got on stage to accept it together. So I feel Academy adjacent. Yeah. OK, we can go with that. I just love the fact that you got one. I mean, it was an incredible performance as our I mean, let's be real.

[00:16:13] All of your performance are incredible, which is part of the reason why I think we've got this documentary being made. Is that correct, Derek? That would be part of it. Yes. Part of it is also because I feel that there are not enough people that know exactly who Doug Jones is and he doesn't receive the accolades that he deserves in Hollywood. To his point, the film Shape of Water won the Oscar, but he doesn't have his own statue for his acting capabilities, which he can act circles around anyone.

[00:16:42] And so this is going to be my little accolade to him. It's my love letter to Doug because he's just an amazing human being and actor. It can confirm. I mean, you know, Doug, I think of all the people that we've met over the years of doing Trek gigs in the last 11 years or so. And I have to say, you know, not because you're here. I'd say this even if you weren't. You probably are the genuinely nicest person we've ever met associated with Star Trek.

[00:17:10] And that is across all of the series and all of the 60 years. I think kindness is the word that comes to mind that Dan mentioned earlier. And it just did. You give everybody just a warm feeling, Doug. That's that's why we want to call you Hug Jones. Well, thank you for that. I've met a lot of other Star Trek actors and there's a lot of nice ones out there. So I don't take this lightly. I'll thank you from the bottom of my heart. You know, we're now, I think, a little over three years since the series wrapped for Discovery.

[00:17:40] It's been a little while since you've been able to inhabit Saru. What do you miss the most about being that character? So, well, Saru, out of all the characters I've played in my 40 year career, I will be an actor 40 years this June, by the way. Wow. Yeah. That anniversary. And in that time, out of all the characters I've played, Saru is the one I got to know the best because I played him the most.

[00:18:07] Over five seasons, that many episodes, I gave the writers a chance to unlayer and peel the layers of the onion back to find out what's beneath the surface on Saru. So backstories came out and he was a very emotional alien. He wore his heart on his sleeve a lot. And I loved all of that. I loved how accessible he was. I mean, he looked non-human, but he was one of the most human characters that those writers gave me ever.

[00:18:37] So I loved his empathy. I loved his leadership skills. These are all things that I wish I was like Saru in so many ways. And he also helped me get over anxiety in my own life because he had to deal with it. And I had to go through that process with him, scripted and memorized, yes. But I took some of it in like, wow, I love how his perception of the world around him has changed. The world around him hasn't changed.

[00:19:04] But his courage and his confidence came out of a flipped perception. We can get through this instead of we're all going to die. Right? I would like to have that in my own life. So I learned so much from him. And I miss that part of it. I also miss the new episodes coming out and fan feedback. That immediate sort of thing that we have with the social medias and hearing so much. Here's what this episode meant to me.

[00:19:34] Here's what, oh, gosh, that moment he went through. I went through something like that in my own life. And a lot of relatability. But the good thing about Trek fans is that never dies. These series are rewatched and rewatched and remembered. So when we do things like the Star Trek conventions or the Star Trek cruise, I get all the feedback and love I could ever possibly ever hope for or want. So I miss some things. But other parts of Saru do live on.

[00:20:03] I'm really thankful for that. I am. I'm so happy to hear, Doug, that you have that kind of feeling for Saru that so many other people do with dealing with anxiety and stuff like that. You did a – Bill did a wonderful article for StarTrek.com a few years ago which talked about how Saru helped him get through a lot of the stuff that he's been going through over the years.

[00:20:25] And I think it's the first time that I've heard an actor talk about the ability to also learn and have positive things come out as it about portraying that character. That's fantastic. Bill, you were very excited about that article. And you brought up some great comments about what the character Saru has done for you over the years. I did. I've learned a lot like Saru, like Doug.

[00:20:50] You know, it's – getting to know Saru over that time has helped me through some things myself. But enough about me. Yes. On that note, Doug, one of the things that I wanted to ask you was, of course, you're known for your amazing portrayals of creatures using layers and layers of makeup and latex and the like. And you've mastered your craft of acting with that shell, so to speak.

[00:21:19] You know, you have Fawn from Pan's Labyrinth and the Moon Guy, Mac Tonight, and the McDonald's commercials back in the day. And of course, Abe Sapien and Hellboy, just to name a few. But we have seen you as human Doug or less latex Doug also, like in Discovery Season 3 as the holographic Saru. Or that wonderful, loving prison guard, Officer Crane and Sons of Anarchy. Oh, you saw that, did you? Yes, I did.

[00:21:49] Or the roles like the Incredible Baron in what we do in the shadows. All fantastic. So my question is, in those times, do you find it harder to act without the makeup or easier due to what you have to do to project all that emotion when you are in full gear? Is it harder, easier, or kind of a mix of both? I think it's kind of same, same, honestly.

[00:22:15] I mean, easier in the fact that, yes, I can get to the set with more energy because I have not been through a seven-hour makeup application process. Sure, yes. And easier because I'm not carrying around extra weight and it's not sticky and it's not hot. I'm not sweating out the back of a head. But a role is a role and a character is a character.

[00:22:37] And getting to know that character and internalize all of his wants, needs, loves, intentions, relationships, all that still has to be there, whether it's a monster or it is a human. So that's why I say same, same. But as far as, like, the vulnerability you might feel, when you're used to walking around like this and, you know, letting this visual be what people see at home, and now it's this.

[00:23:05] That watching myself back as a human is more like, oh, gal, you know. Especially as I'm aging, it's like, oh, there's a wrinkle I didn't know I had. So I'm more judgy pants on my real face. So it's a little harder to watch. But you realize everyone else in the cast is also walking around showing their real face. So even though it feels like walking out of the house in a Speedo, being a bit more exposed, everyone else is in Speedos too. We're all at the pool. It's okay. It's okay.

[00:23:37] I don't think anyone wants to see me in a Speedo. I'm just going to throw that out there. I don't know. You didn't have to. It's a comment section. Yeah, yeah. Oh, no. Yeah. Doug, very quickly on that, just one other quick question. When season three was, you know, when you were reading the scripts and everything like that, and we, you found out that there was going to be this episode or a couple of episodes where your character had a hologram projecting yourself as human.

[00:24:06] Was that a, well, you just kind of answered a little bit. Was that an oh my God or oh, cool moment? Or was it again a mixture of both? It was absolutely both of those things. My first thing was reading the script. I had not. And I didn't get a heads up from our writers room what was coming. I wanted, I told them ahead. I, they let each of us actors on the series have as much information as we wanted. And I was one of those. It's like, give me one episode at a time. I want to go through this episode by episode like an audience would.

[00:24:36] So, so I'm reading this episode going, oh, oh, human. Ah, wow. So first of all, it was like, oh, this will be awesome. I'll be out of the makeup trailer in 20 minutes and study, right? You know, ah, a little, little, little, boom, boom, boom, little hair. We're done. And then the other part of me was like, oh no, I know how to play Saru with rubber bits on. I don't know how to play him with his face, right? And that also meant flat footed and not in my hoof boots.

[00:25:03] So my whole posture, my whole physicality from the ground up starts with those hoof boots. In a flat boot, that, well, can I still affect who Saru is as a human? So I thought, oh gosh, I hope the audience buys this. So that was a bit of a challenge, but also at the same time, I loved being able to have my own hands without those gloved, gloved rubber bits on my hands, which meant that I could go to the bathroom whenever I wanted. I could drink as much coffee on set as I wanted.

[00:25:31] I go to the snack table and not worry about my lips coming unglued. It was, no, it was wonderful. That's awesome. Craft services does make the difference sometimes. It does, yeah. Derek, so given the fact that, you know, Doug has had a 40-year career, it must have been quite a unique challenge to wrangle up a variety of celebrities to appear in the documentary.

[00:25:58] So I would imagine that you've got quite the array of folks. Well, wrangling, well, I guess that's one way to put it. So far we've been lucky and everyone that we've approached has said yes, which is no one has said no, which is grace. The hardest part is getting to them because Doug doesn't know everybody, so sometimes we have to reach out to agents or managers, and so that's a hurdle that you need to get over. But everyone that we've gotten and who has done their interviews,

[00:26:25] people like Sonequa Martin-Green, Noah Wiley, Ron Perlman, and a slew of others. I mean, we've got tons, and we've got some that are coming up that we haven't announced yet because our rule is even though they've agreed to do it, we will not announce them being in the film until we actually have them on camera because then, you know, anything could go wrong. So we get sick, someone break a leg, someone can go to, you know, another part of the world, and we can't shoot them.

[00:26:49] So it's been fantastic, and hearing everybody's stories about what a genuine person Doug is and how they're so happy to have been a part of his life and to be a part of this documentary has just been a real blessing. Like we, I tease Doug all the time. We mention in a lot of these podcasts, I said one of the things we started asking people early on was give us a little bit of dirt about Doug. Has he ever complained about anything?

[00:27:18] And after like the fifth interview, we're like, we're just going to stop asking because nobody's going to complain about this man, and they have not because they have nothing to complain about. Well, I appreciate that you stopped asking because as much trust as I put in him. So yes, if you want to produce a documentary, I trust you to put that together. And then I find out he's trying to dig up dirt on me with all my old friends and colleagues. Like, oh, okay. Yeah, I feel safe. Sure, thanks. Well, you know, we want to put butts in seats, Doug.

[00:27:47] You know, that's what we're talking about. I know. Yeah. So Derek, you've also, you know, got a great director, you know, a friend of Trek Geeks, William Conlon, a great Star Trek fan, a great person. Tell me about bringing him on board and what he brings to the project. Sure. So William, I was unaware of who William was for a very long time, but another friend of mine introduced me to him.

[00:28:13] And he said, you've got to see his movie Making Apes, which is a documentary about the making of Planet of the Apes and the history of makeup. And it's on Amazon, by the way, for those of you who want to watch it, it was great. So I watched it and I love documentaries as a whole. I love to learn things because I don't like reading and documentaries are so much easier. So I watched it and I was surprised at how captivated I was and lost in an actual story rather than

[00:28:43] it just be only talking heads. Because some documentaries can just be only talking heads and it gets very boring. So when it was over, I was like, that was really good. And I didn't put the pieces of the puzzle together at that moment that I may need him for something down the line. And then when I, Doug turned me down twice to do the documentary. It was on the third time when I introduced him to William and I told him how great he was and how great Making Apes was that Doug was like, well, okay.

[00:29:14] He tells that story better, but it was, William is, he has a great way to tell stories. And since it's not a scripted fictitional story, how do you take someone's real life with talking heads and a couple of other things that we're filming to bring, to bring a storyline together and make it interesting that people are going to want to sit in their seats and want to sit through the whole thing? Because it is feature length. This is not a half hour documentary that you see, you know, on your typical streaming or on TV. Yeah. YouTube. It's a feature length.

[00:29:42] You know, this is two hours of telling Doug's story. And I have every confident that he's going to pull it off strictly because of Making Apes. It was so amazing. So, yeah, I can't wait because we're, we have so much footage that we've shot and I make a joke to him all the time. I said, we're going to have three versions of the film. There's going to be the theatrical cut, which is just what everyone will see two hours. And then there will be the director's cut. That will be four hours. And then there will be the executive producer's cut.

[00:30:10] The executive producer's super, super, super cut. That will be six hours because we have so much footage and, and we have the basics of the story that we want to tell in place. That's the amount of writing that goes into a documentary and outside the questions. But the documentary story will form as we get more stories from people and we go, oh no, that's a direction we need to go. So I, I don't envy that part of William's job at all, but watch.

[00:30:39] And you can imagine how humbling and embarrassing almost this is for me to even hear this like six hours of me. We really should have sold it as a TV series. Who would sit and watch that? I wouldn't watch it. Yeah, they would. Yeah, they would. Like an 80s style opening with the music and oh yeah, it would be fantastic. I'd sit down and watch y'all a lot of time, Doug. Absolutely. Derek, is, is there any one thing in his, in Doug's incredible career that you want to

[00:31:08] make sure you talk about in this documentary? Is there one thing that just, you want to really make sure it hits home hard? Yeah, well it's, it's, I tell, I've told the story many, many, many times and it's actually the catalyst of the documentary. So having, having gone to film school and grown up wanting to be an actor myself and learning about what it takes to bring film to life.

[00:31:32] I grew up on Star Wars and Star Trek and I saw many years later, Pan's Labyrinth. And Pan's Labyrinth today is, to this day is my end all be all favorite film of all time. I love the story. I love the acting. Everything about it is phenomenal. And I had met Doug not long after watching Pan's Labyrinth for the first time and coming up to his table, I saw pictures. I went, oh my God, that's you? That's you?

[00:31:59] And we're at a convention and we just got to know each other over a three day course. It was in Germany. Germany and Amsterdam. In Amsterdam. And I was captivated by the story that Doug told about how, when Guillermo approached him to do the film, one of Doug's concerns was that he, it was a Spanish speaking film and Doug doesn't speak Spanish. And he's like, how am I going to deliver a performance for you that, you know, is going

[00:32:28] to encapsulate the story and, and, and make the audience not be like, look how fake that is. Is it, you know, so, so tell that part of the story. So I, so I told Guillermo he was out of his mind and he should really not hire me and get a Spanish actor. Cause I'm going to ruin your movie. Right. And I, I read the script in Spanish, in English to start with. And then I, that's when I was like, oh my gosh, I love this. I have to be in it. It's going to be in Spanish. Oh no, no, no. I should not be in this at all.

[00:32:55] So Guillermo said to me, Dougie, you can count the 10 for all I care. I can double rate later, but you'll got to play the phone. So, okay. So what he did there was kind of smart. He gave me an out, an easy out to like get through dialogue moments by counting to 10 and having it just timed right. So they can dub in something in later. Um, but I couldn't, I, the artist in me could not leave him with that.

[00:33:20] Uh, then if you do dub over that, then lip sync would be, I would be saying one to 10 in English and he'd have a Spanish dialogue going, it wouldn't match. It'd be, oh, it'd be a nightmare. And then also I'm working with 11 year old Ivana Beccaro on set. All my scenes were with this little girl and you're expecting an 11 year old to have visceral, real reactions to somebody counting to 10 in English. And you're right. So no, that would have been a disaster. That would have been a disaster.

[00:33:47] So I knew I had to buckle down and learn the Spanish of the movie. So I did get, uh, I had my English translation, my Spanish translation of the film, and I could break down each line word for word knowing what, what meant what. And I, I just worked it out for myself and I, and I spent five months with high blood pressure and stressing about this movie. And yeah, I, I, I, so anyway, it came out, I was able, I was word perfect on the day when whenever we filmed at any scene.

[00:34:16] And, um, and I was shocked at myself, but I was shocked at what the human brain can contain and retain. And it was that story when I heard it and I'm sitting there going, I'm like, there is not a single actor I know of in Hollywood that would have that amount of dedication for art. And I never forgot that story. And now Doug and I have been, you know, together in business, you know, I'm his appearance manager. We've traveled the world for 18 years.

[00:34:46] And so that's what's like, and I've watched Doug go through good, good parts of his career, bad parts of his career. He's cried on my shoulder. He's invited me to premieres to cheer him on. And, and I, I always revert back to that time I first met him and he told me this story because now when I go back and watch, I went back and watch Pan's Labyrinth after meeting him and didn't read any of the subtitles. It was just watching. And I, it was like, you would never know that this actor that you're watching on screen wasn't a Spanish speaking actor.

[00:35:16] It's mind numbing. It's, it's, it's, so how can someone put that amount of dedication into art? What's because Doug's a real actor. You know, it's not about, Oh, how funny can I be? And how famous can I be? Doug wants, it's the art of storytelling. And so after that, that was the catalyst for the documentary. I want everyone to know that story and a thousand more stories that you don't know about what he's gone through in his career to be who he is to this day.

[00:35:46] And it's, ah, I love you. I love you more. The part that made it more appealing to me was, was also having a voice and what, what goes into a documentary about me. Cause I was kind of like, I, I, I have done podcasts like this where we go through my career time and time again. I want it to be something more than just career bullet points. Uh, so adding things like my three older brothers, I'm the youngest of four boys. We're, we're, I have scheduled to get them on film being interviewed.

[00:36:15] We, uh, we have my lovely Mrs. Lori daughter, Natisha. We have, we, these are people that, that don't aren't out in public much and they're going to have their perception of me to talk about, which is kind of, I'm a little terrified of that too. We even were able to, um, we went to the star Trek cruise, uh, a day early to, so we could stay in Florida an extra day. Cause my, we found my, um, my high school drama teacher from Indiana is retired living in Florida now.

[00:36:45] And she came out to be interviewed. Um, and we got a reunion, a genuine reunion after, after 40 plus years on film of us screaming and giggling and not staged at all. We didn't meet in the lobby first and then say, let's go. We, I brought, when I got the cue on my phone, I brought him up to the room and when the doors open, yeah. Yeah. Reminiscing with her.

[00:37:11] And this is a woman who knew me as a 14 to 18 year old, um, and was the first person in my, in my young, dreamy, creative life that could do something with it. Uh, so I was able to gush on her and tell her that, well, what all that meant to me, she gushed back. And she also brought a folder with her that had newspaper and magazine clippings in it from all my career that she's been tracking all this time. It was like, Oh, no, it was quite precious to it.

[00:37:40] So moments like that, you don't get in a typical interview on, you know, right. Yeah. So I'm really tickled pink that we're going to include that. That's amazing. You know, Derek said a few minutes ago that, you know, it took until a third time for you to say yes. What was it that made you ultimately say yes, knowing that you're going to have to, you know, watch this, you know, this, this 12 hour long, super duper executive producer cut and see all of this, you know, on screen.

[00:38:07] Uh, well, I think it was because the idea of it, it was, we were at, it was the Star Trek convention in Las Vegas and, um, we were about to start the day and I got a text from Derek saying, come to my room at the hotel before we go downstairs. Uh, cause I want to, I want to run something by you. I get to his room and he's there with director William Conlon. We just talked about, and Doug, this is William. And he's the one who did the making apes and he really big fan of yours.

[00:38:36] He wants to treat this with your kit gloves and he wants to take care of your life story. And so I'm like, okay. You can imagine, right? Yeah. And so, so, uh, and then I'm like, gosh, I still don't see what there is to document. Uh, and, and I know it's going to be a lot of work. Oh, so much work. No, we'll do everything. You know, but there's people I know that you don't know that I'm going to have to call email something. Uh, but we, uh, they convinced me. What do you think?

[00:39:07] I'm okay. Cameras come out. We go downstairs. They start filming that day. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, good. We got to go ahead. So, so all the fan interaction at my table that happened over the weekend and walking around the hallways to and from my, my events, uh, seeing people along the way, they caught a lot of testimonials of, of fans leaving my table about their experience with me.

[00:39:30] Um, uh, and they caught footage on me on stage, having done a panel or two, uh, or the special meet and greet events they have at those. So it was like, they had enough footage from that first convention two years ago for documentary. That was just the beginning. And so, uh, and, and the convention side of my life is just one little, little chapter of the, of the bigger story. Uh, so I realized, oh my gosh, there's, there's 65 years of life to pull together, not just

[00:40:00] career. So it's a lot. That's amazing. So Doug, um, uh, uh, first of all, uh, Derek, I should say, uh, get me doug jones.com is the website right now. Um, can you tell us a little bit about the, um, uh, the crowdfunding that's going to be kicking off in the near future? So I want to make it very clear as I'm very proud. We were able to raise the funds to shoot principal photography all on our own from private investors

[00:40:28] and, and, and, which is, it's hard to do as an independent filmmaker. And, but now we're at a point where we need to finish the film and finishing the film. There's some music that we want in it that you need to pay rights to, and you've got to pay an editor. Then one of the biggest things for an independent film, especially is going to all the film festivals and film festivals. You know, everyone sees cons and Sundance on TV and they go, oh, look, all the actors went there. Yes. But you know what? You got to pay for those actors to get there and you got to pay to have the film submitted.

[00:40:57] And it's, it's, there's a lot of expenses. And so because I want the film to be in theaters and I wanted to get picked up for full blown distribution from a major studio, we have to invest in all of those things and make this, this is just not an independent film. That's going to fall by the wayside. This is going to be the, as legit as you can get until Fox or Warner brothers or somebody comes to us and just writes us a huge check. I want it to feel like we are the big studio behind it. And, but what we're, what we need is we need folks to help us.

[00:41:27] And so we were, we are going to have a crowdfunding finishing campaign on a certain platform that we don't know about yet. And we're, we're adding things right now, which is why our platform, our release date got pushed. We were supposed to be on April 20th. We're adding some new things, some new elements. And Doug has been gracious enough to donate some stuff from his own personal archives, things like signed scripts and actual prosthetic pieces from Star Trek discovery.

[00:41:53] And most castmates have been gracious enough to sign some limited prints for us and things. So there's going to be so many things that people can help us tell this story. And then eventually we will be going out, you know, even if we don't get major distribution, we're going to do all the art houses like Alamo draft house and stuff like that. So we are going to be in theaters one way or another. And then my company, because of other projects that we've produced, we already have a deal with Amazon.

[00:42:23] So no matter what happens, it will be on Amazon at some point, but you know, the dream is theatrical release and it's going to happen. So it just takes time. So if anyone is out there that wants to learn more about that, if you go to getmedougjones.com, once the campaign goes live, it'll be on there. And then, you know, there's no pressure. Just we want you to come see the film at the end of the day. So that's fantastic.

[00:42:47] And of course, by our seeing you at conventions all the time, our sponsors of our live stream here and of our podcast is our dear friends at Fansets, which of course you have a phenomenal relationship with as well. So I've heard a rumor and I think we've got a screen grab of it here that they're actually going to have a specific exclusive pin for this particular documentary that's being built up right now. So tell us a little bit about that.

[00:43:17] And of course, John and Lou, I mean, they've done such great stuff for you guys in the past. There's some awesome Doug pins that I have on my walls and everything like that. You're wearing a couple right now. I see. I am wearing it. I'm wearing two Saroos right now, as a matter of fact. Absolutely. Shout out to John and Lou. Yay! Oh, God. Don't give them any more bigger heads than that. Love them. Love them. Yeah. Well, we've gone to them for numerous merchandising things over the years since we've met and they've become good friends now.

[00:43:47] And so when we came up to this documentary and trying to come up with some cool things for the crowd finishing campaign, it was like, wow, we got to bring in Fansets. So we came up with various designs, but really at the end of the day, it always pushed back to the poster, which you see behind us. This poster, I think, just speaks volumes of to what the story is about and who Doug is. And so I was kind of insistent on let's get a version of a pin for that. So you can flash it again. I mean, you put it pretty quick.

[00:44:16] So that's kind of the pin that we settled on. The actual final, I believe that is the final design. I'm pretty sure. And so those will be part of one of the crowd finishing things on there. It's one of the lower tiers so more people can have them. And actually, we just found out. So this will be exclusive to your podcast. We just found out that that pin is going to have two versions. We're going to do the generic version, which is what you see there.

[00:44:43] Then we're going to do a special version that has gold trim that Doug's going to sign. And those are going to be limited to, I think, only 50 pieces. This one's an open edition. It'll be exclusive to the film only. You'll only be able to get it from us. But it's an open edition. So it's basically going to be however many we need to print, we will. So there you go. You guys just got a little exclusive announcement on your show. So yay! Love it! Yay! Well, I need more Doug stuff in my life.

[00:45:13] I mean, I have my signed Saru bust right there. Yeah. Right next to Spock kind of overlooking. He's on Thursday Night Geeks every week. Thursday Night Geeks presented by Fansets, by the way, is the official name of the show. We can stop talking about Fansets. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, they've had their moment in the sun. We're done with them. So, you know, obviously, I mean, convention season is firing up. I would imagine that we're going to be talking about the doc at a lot of conventions, perhaps.

[00:45:43] Every convention we go to, we talk about it. And we, on the cruise, we started handing out little cards with QR codes on the back. One is the IMDB QR code, which anyone out there can go. You just go to imdb.com, look up Get Me Doug Jones, and you can add it to your watch list, which is what we want because it shows people like, you know, the higher up. That's how the numbers go up on the film. Then once the film is actually seen, people can go in and leave reviews, and the numbers go up again as well.

[00:46:12] And then, so yeah, every convention we go to, we are promoting the film. And I'm actually going to be a guest speaker at Trek Long Island in June. They're allowing me to do a 30-minute panel all about the film. So unfortunately, Doug can't be there this year, but he gave us the blessing to do it.

[00:46:36] But Tracy Martinson is going to moderate the panel, and Tracy was the behind-the-scenes producer-director on Star Trek, on all the Star Trek series, basically. All the Star Trek series bonus features for the DVD release. Oh, okay. Oh, very cool. All that. She's done all the interviews with all the cast members for all the years. And so she's got a lot to talk about. Yeah, so she's going to be a guest of Trek Long Island in and over herself.

[00:47:04] But part of her duties while there are to do the panels. And so she's going to be my moderator. So I get to be interviewed by Tracy. By Tracy. Yes. Awesome. And then, so we'll be doing, I'll be doing a poster signing after the panel. And then we always tell people, the poster is the one thing that Doug will always sign, and there's no fee for it. So if you get a poster signed from me, if you see Doug at a show, you can bring it to the table. So, okay. That's great. I'll do that when I have permission. Yeah.

[00:47:33] If I ever do this, he's like, well, okay. I can imagine. Yeah. My last question is going to be for you, Doug. And that's, it's been a few years since we saw Saru for the last time. And of course, we love him and always will hold a very special place in our hearts. Can you tell us what's coming up next?

[00:47:58] Any big announcements that you can share or that have already been shared or maybe not have been shared of what's coming down the road? Well, I wish. I had huge things to tell you. But since Discovery ended and I took Saru off for the last time, I thought, you know what? I really want to lean into more human characters if I can. If there are human characters out there without rubber bits attached, I want to see what I can do from this point forward. And independent filmmakers have come out of the woodwork.

[00:48:28] And I've stayed very busy. Everything from independent feature films to short films. And if I have time and a character that interests me, a director that I want to work with, I have been saying yes, yes, yes. So I have two films that are in festivals right now. One is a short film called Pretty Boys, and it just won Best Short at the Desert Escape Festival in Utah.

[00:48:55] At the same festival was a feature film that I have a very small supporting part in, but it's called The Strawberry. And it stars Mike Farrell from the TV show MASH. He played B.J. Honeycutt. Mike is, you know, he's in his 80s now. So he plays an elderly patient who's just been given his end-of-life prognosis. And I am the doctor who delivers this news to him. And I've been, the rest of the movie is him dealing with his family and what's to come of this.

[00:49:23] And then at the end of the movie, they come back to me for me to talk the whole family through what the process will be from this point forward. So it sounds very clinical, but I also had a chance to put some emotion and gravity and layers to this doctor. Because when a patient is given an end-of-life prognosis, that doctor and all the medical professionals kind of become a weird part of the family at that point. Because we kind of see the family through the rest of this person's life.

[00:49:52] And so I played a doctor who had been a family doctor for this family in a small town for a while. So there was a personal friendship connection and a clinical connection that I got to. I only had two scenes, but I was able to infuse all of it with the love and care that I seek in a good bedside manner. So the Starbreak just won Best Feature at the Desert Skate Film Festival.

[00:50:19] And it just won the Audience Award and Best Central Coast Film at the San Luis Obispo Film Festival in California here. And it's just started its run at festivals. So it's going to keep going and keep winning awards. And Mike Farrell, he is fantastic in it, unlike anything you've seen him do ever before. So that's just a couple things.

[00:50:44] I also did guest star on a TV show called Blue Ridge with Jonathan Sheck from That Thing You Do. And season two, whenever it comes out, I think it's going to hit Amazon. I think that's where it aired the first time, the first season. I did one episode, and it was great. It was all about me. And I was a hillbilly living in the woods, and they kind of came upon me. And I had to affect a lot of the story there.

[00:51:10] I also just did a four-episode arc on a new little comedy miniseries that is starring Roseanne Barr and Randy Quaid. It's going to be a hoot. Wow. It was a zany, silly comedy, and I got to play a very zany, silly comedy character in it. That's all I can say about that. I absolutely love it. Yeah, I absolutely love it. Awesome. That's great.

[00:51:38] So here, we're going to give you guys one more exclusive for your show. Awesome, okay. I'm trying to do this. Because you guys are Trek-centric, this will be good. So Doug was just speaking about taking the Saru mask off for the last time. We caught that on film. Derek came up to the set in Toronto with cameras to capture my last, my final makeup application and removal. And apart from removal, I think it was a bit emotional for me because I thought, I don't know when I'm going to see Saru again. It's like the saying goodbye to you. You're moving out of town.

[00:52:08] And, you know, will I ever see you again? So the makeup goes on in four pieces. And then at the end of the day, they slice it up the back and it comes off in one piece. I held it on my hand. And Whitney Houston was playing in the trailer because we always had music going. And what song was up? But I will always love you. So I started singing. Wow. This is the moment. I got to capture it. That's amazing.

[00:52:36] You even had hair even when you had the – I always thought you were bald the whole time that you had the Saru mask on. I was. My final day on Discovery was when we came back. Oh, that's right. From that epilogue after my hair had grown a bit. And we bald-capped me for that one day. So did you keep that Saru mask? That is in my personal collection now, yes. Did you keep anything else from set after wrap? Yes. I have – if you remember, Saru wore a brooch.

[00:53:06] Yeah, yeah. My high council pin from my home planet of Kaminar. I have that – my final pin worn on camera. They had a few. I had like five of them. But I kept the last one that I wore on camera. I also have – I have a couple pairs of the hoof boots. Now, one is from – are the leather black ones from season one with my old uniform markings on it. But those are fine.

[00:53:31] But the ones I'm actually putting into the Kickstarter campaign or Indigo or whatever it's going to be on, there's one pair that was made that was the prototype pair. It was made out of blue neoprene just to see the shape, the fit, camera walk in them. And that was my practice pair. There's only one of those in the world, and I own them, and they are going to go up for – as a reward. There they are. That's so cool. Yeah. That's incredible.

[00:54:00] I'm going to sign them, and they'll be a part of a reward probably at a higher level of giving I'm going to get. Yeah, yeah. Crucif as well because we haven't announced those yet. So Doug just released that info on his own. We got – dude, we got specials coming. We got announcements coming left and right here today. You're signing nine and a half for anybody else. You were there? Damn. The better never wear them. Oh, my gosh. That's right. They're going in the case, the acrylic and everything. Guys, it's been so great to talk to you.

[00:54:30] Have all of our listeners and viewers and everybody out there stay up to date on all the news on this crowdfunding. Head over to GetMeDougJones.com. Keep an eye out for the launch of the campaign. You can check out on Facebook and Instagram and other social media sites the different things that will be available that we talked about today. Like, oh, I don't know, one-of-a-kind screen-accurate bust of the fawn from Del Toro's iconic Academy Award-winning film, Pan's Labyrinth. Yeah, one of them.

[00:54:59] And you can also – that comes – we talked about it. That comes right from your private archive, Doug. And also, there's an – just another example. It's an autographed original script from the Discovery Series finale signed by Doug. Oh, and somebody else by the name of Sonequa Martin-Green or something like that signed it also. So that's kind of cool too. All kinds of great stuff. This project is going to be awesome, gentlemen. We are so happy to be able to talk to you about it.

[00:55:24] We're so glad that we get to see you at conventions every year and just kind of just say hi again and talk about all the things that you have done to make our lives much more enjoyable by watching your craft. So thank you very, very much. Oh, gosh. You humbled me. Thank you so much for all the love. I'm taking it in. Thank you for having us on. And everybody, come see the film no matter what. That's what I care about. Definitely. Yeah.

[00:56:05] And Dan, we're back. We are. Hi. So we did have to record that conversation with Doug a few days ago just to accommodate his schedule. He wasn't able to do live on Thursday night. So – but, man, we got some great announcements from that conversation. And this documentary sounds like it's going to be amazing. It really does. It's so cool. And, you know, we – of course, we were both there for the – when we recorded it.

[00:56:33] But I forgot about – I forgot about the last announcement. I'm like, oh, my God. We had like four. That interview was fantastic. It is going to be – it's going to be very special, I think, for you and I especially and the people that love what he has done with Saru in the Star Trek universe. Saru has got a very special place for a lot of people.

[00:56:55] And I think that this is incredibly deserved for what Doug has contributed to the acting world over his 40 years. My God, that's just absolutely unbelievable. And you talked – when we had him on the first time, you talked about how he was a clown in one of the Batman – Batman Returns. Yeah. So it's just incredible what he's done in his career. I can't wait to see this. I want it to get picked up by a major studio so that it's in the theaters.

[00:57:25] But I'm also very happy that it's going to be on such a major platform like Amazon because just being on a platform like that means it's going to get watched by a ton of people. And I think that's great. I'm so happy for both he and Derek. So in the last couple of days, we do have some updates, Dan, that you need to tell us about with regard to the documentary, the crowdfunding. So why don't you go ahead and catch us up? Yeah. Yeah.

[00:57:50] The first thing to let everybody know is that they have decided that they are going to be going with Kickstarter. That Kickstarter campaign is scheduled to go live this coming Monday, the 18th of May, 2026. There's the website right now. Just go to Kickstarter. Do a search for Get Me Doug Jones. You'll get to the page. And, of course, once it goes live, you'll be able to see all the information about what they're looking to raise, all the different levels,

[00:58:15] all the different things that are going to be available, like all those great, great items from Doug's personal archive. It's all going to be listed there. So make sure you bookmark that page. Check it out on Monday. See what's available. And if you are able to donate, great. So that's pretty awesome. The other thing is a couple other cool announcements with regards to this documentary. They announced this one today, and it's really, really amazing.

[00:58:40] We already know that people like Sonequa Martin-Green and Harvey Guillen from What We Do in the Shadows, Ron Perlman from Hellboy and some pile of crap Star Trek movie called Insurrection, or Nemesis, excuse me. Nemesis. It's Ron Pile of Crap. And Noah Wiley from Falling Skies. They've already been talking about, they've already been announced as part of this documentary.

[00:59:06] And today they announced that the one and only Bette Midler has been interviewed for this documentary. And just as a quote, she said, quote, working with Doug on Hocus Pocus was like working with a master. He embodies every character that he plays with complete commitment. That's just one of the things that she had to say about Doug. And she's a legend in Hollywood and herself.

[00:59:31] So to be able to get names like they've already talked about is really quite incredible. And I'm very, very excited that they were able to get her. Also, if you are in the Hollywood area, this is big. I wish I was out in Hollywood just for this because it's pretty incredible. So the campaign is launching on May 18th at noon Pacific time.

[00:59:53] On May 19th in Hollywood, head on over to the Scum and Villainy Cantina that night for a special Doug Jones trivia night. And oh, Doug Jones is going to be there too. So go see Doug in Scum and Villainy if you can. That's incredibly convenient that he'd be there for Doug Jones night. I know. It's pretty. Well, you would think. You would think. But very, very cool. A lot of good things coming out.

[01:00:21] If you check out Cool Water Productions, all of their social media pages, they're doing lots of updates. I'm on Facebook looking at all the updates that they have every day. Lots of great information. I really think and hope that this is going to be a very successful campaign. And knowing the guys that we do, we have kind of like an inside because we've gotten to know them a little bit. Along with our friends at Fansets, we've gotten to talk to Doug and everybody. We have cool waters a lot. They have their shit together.

[01:00:47] And I think that Derek is going to put together a great, great documentary. And of course, with William Directoring, it's going to be great. Well, and so keep in mind, this coming Monday, March. I'm sorry, May 18th. I don't know what the hell I'm talking about. May 18th, the Kickstarter campaign goes live. I'd love to see them clear past all of those goals and have to add new ones. Which I know that they'd be more than happy to do.

[01:01:11] But I can't wait for Get Me, Doug Jones, to become a reality and to be in our faces on screens everywhere. That's the goal. And I hope we get there because Doug certainly deserves this kind of respect and treatment and documentary form for sure. Absolutely. It's, I don't want to say long overdue because they've just been talking about this for a little while. But I'm so glad that they did come up with the idea.

[01:01:35] If you're going to talk about actors and people that we know in the Star Trek universe, Doug is a perfect example for someone who should have a documentary like this made. Well, you know, he's kind of like, you know, the Lon Chaney Jr. of our generation. You know, people are talking about it being the Boris Karloff of our generation. Any one of those great creature artists of days gone by. And there haven't been any since. You know, Doug is the only one.

[01:02:03] So I think it's perfectly befitting for an icon like him to do this. So Dan, that's going to wrap us up for this week. Okay. I hope everybody goes out there and supports the Kickstarter. And we'll certainly update the next time we're here for Thursday night. But until then, he's Danjo. I'm Bill. Danjo! We hope everybody lives long and prospers and has a great week. Thanks for joining us, everybody. We'll see you next time.

[01:02:34] Coconut banjo. Coconut banjo? Is that a banjo made out of coconut? Or is that a coconut made from a banjo? Just sign up. Music for Trek Geeks is provided by Five Year Mission. They're creating one original song for each episode of Star Trek. Get their music at fiveyearmission.net. Trek Geeks and Thursday Night Geeks are a production of Coconut Media Works. Executive producers Bill Smith and Dan Davidson.

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