Phumzile Sitole: Another Theater Kid on Star Trek

[00:00:00] Hey everyone, I'm Pumzelis Etolea and you're listening to SyFy Sistas.

[00:00:30] Hi everybody, welcome to the SyFy Sistas podcast where we give you our point of view.

[00:00:41] I'm your host, Tamia Harper and I'm joined today by my sister Sabrina Wood.

[00:00:46] Woo-hoo.

[00:00:47] Evette Blackmonton.

[00:00:49] Hello.

[00:00:50] And Fran T.

[00:00:51] What's happening?

[00:00:52] What's happening Fran?

[00:00:54] What's happening?

[00:00:56] What's happening Fran?

[00:00:57] We're proud members of the Trek Geeks podcast network and on this here network, we've got

[00:01:03] a really good show for you today because we have a sister of our heart with us.

[00:01:08] We got to meet her at Trek Long Island and we were so excited to meet her.

[00:01:14] We've loved her work.

[00:01:16] American audiences, you'll probably familiar with her from Orange is a new black

[00:01:22] and the good fight but in our world, in our hearts she is general of Earth, General Doye.

[00:01:32] And she is none other than Pumzelis Etole.

[00:01:35] Welcome to the show Pumie.

[00:01:45] Really? Thank you for having me.

[00:01:48] Well, we're really excited to have you.

[00:01:50] I feel like when we got to meet each other at Trek Long Island it felt like you were just family.

[00:01:57] Like your heart is so big and your smile brightens the entire room and you make everybody

[00:02:04] feel so comfortable.

[00:02:05] So I just wanted to say thank you for that.

[00:02:08] You made us feel so welcome.

[00:02:10] I appreciate that.

[00:02:12] Thank you.

[00:02:13] It was a lot.

[00:02:13] It was really special.

[00:02:14] It was a great one.

[00:02:16] It was.

[00:02:17] It was super cool, right?

[00:02:18] That was your first convention experience, right?

[00:02:21] Finch and first convention and I really loved it so much.

[00:02:28] It was a lot of fun.

[00:02:29] We had a blast at that convention.

[00:02:31] They did a great job and I can't wait for next year because I think it's going to be even

[00:02:36] better next year.

[00:02:37] You know, it was really cool.

[00:02:38] We had all of you guys from disco on there.

[00:02:41] That was really lovely.

[00:02:42] Had you been able to see any of those folks like in between or is this your first time seeing a lot of them?

[00:02:48] A lot of them was my time.

[00:02:49] It was the first time actually meeting Raven in person.

[00:02:51] We had never worked together so I've never ever.

[00:02:55] And it was crazy how much she felt like family.

[00:03:00] We since actually we just had a FaceTime call the other day for so long and it's just so

[00:03:06] honestly that convention was like solidified us because we were just like

[00:03:11] oh my goodness, thank goodness.

[00:03:15] I was one of those moments so it was the first time meeting her.

[00:03:22] I hadn't seen David for a while but he's always been like a brother, man, told to me so I just

[00:03:27] like I couldn't get enough of just hugging him and squeezing all the like advice out of him

[00:03:34] that I could which I always do.

[00:03:38] I'm like David.

[00:03:44] I've seen him for a minute.

[00:03:46] That's so cool.

[00:03:47] When you saw you and Raven together, it really looked like there was a heart connection.

[00:03:52] Like we thought you guys had been besties.

[00:03:55] You don't have a lot of time.

[00:03:57] We had literally met that convention.

[00:04:00] Wow.

[00:04:04] That's so cool.

[00:04:05] So the first thing I want to ask you, I just want to put it to bed.

[00:04:10] Like because a lot of people say like Jonathan Freaks was all up on the ready room and he was

[00:04:17] talking about how you were saying that you were considering giving up acting before you got this

[00:04:25] role on Discovery.

[00:04:27] Is this true?

[00:04:29] It's so back and forth.

[00:04:30] It's so funny because this was awesome.

[00:04:32] I'm constantly dead.

[00:04:35] Okay, so I was mostly talking about in this country.

[00:04:39] I was just kind of like this is really tough.

[00:04:44] Auditioning has not been going my way.

[00:04:47] It's very strenuous and it had just been a really tough process for me.

[00:04:53] You know coming here you have to work on an O1 visa which means that you can only work as an actor.

[00:05:00] So that, wow, and to survive trying to get money, my family's not crazy, wealthier home trying

[00:05:09] to get like the ran conversion of sense to like survive here maybe do an under the table job

[00:05:15] which I shouldn't probably be saying.

[00:05:17] Like I just was not making ends meet because I can't legally work with anything else but an actor.

[00:05:26] Now I'm on a green card so it's a different situation.

[00:05:28] Thank you, Aud.

[00:05:29] But at that time that wasn't the case and just not booking, not booking was getting to the point

[00:05:35] that I just cannot sustain myself.

[00:05:38] So it was getting to the point where I was just like I can't make ends meet.

[00:05:42] I don't think I can sustain myself in this country.

[00:05:45] I need to figure out what to do next and that was going to until probably going home

[00:05:50] and figuring out what the next steps was.

[00:05:52] It was never a matter of checking out of my calling as an actor

[00:05:56] which I think is what he heard.

[00:05:58] That was never the case but it was definitely a matter of if I hadn't booked that it was going

[00:06:07] to be a real reckoning with where to go next.

[00:06:13] Or just stepping out of the industry in this country and like yeah, I just I couldn't

[00:06:18] I don't think I could have sustained myself in America realistically on that visa as an artist.

[00:06:26] Yeah, I had no idea.

[00:06:27] That's really interesting.

[00:06:28] See this is why I wanted to ask you that because I don't have reading this stuff and I'm

[00:06:32] hearing this stuff and I was like really?

[00:06:36] Because that doesn't sound right.

[00:06:39] With the past work and everything else you had done,

[00:06:42] they didn't write the whole I'm going to give up.

[00:06:45] Like why are you doing really great?

[00:06:47] Right.

[00:06:48] Yeah, no.

[00:06:49] I'm also just I'm a theater kid, right?

[00:06:51] So you're such a part of me was just like oh well maybe TV is not for me.

[00:06:56] I'm going to go back to theater.

[00:06:58] I love you.

[00:06:59] That was for me that's not a loss.

[00:07:00] I was never like stepping out of acting.

[00:07:02] I was like I'm going to go kick it on the stage for a while, maybe try theater.

[00:07:07] I mean TV and film again sure it'll always be there.

[00:07:11] But stepping off the stage or stepping out of a costume or a characters never really where my soul

[00:07:20] would let me out.

[00:07:20] I could never be content in like what like being a lawyer or a suit.

[00:07:28] So I think that yeah, I just I think he maybe didn't get it that way.

[00:07:33] Right.

[00:07:34] The stage love is David that another thing that you guys connect with you and David Agala both stage

[00:07:41] stage two.

[00:07:41] Yeah.

[00:07:42] Love us?

[00:07:43] Yeah, yeah.

[00:07:44] And that is something that we spoke about.

[00:07:46] I remember having a long chat with him actually about that.

[00:07:50] We were talking about that on one of the the set that we were all and was actually seasoned

[00:07:56] for the last season that I was on.

[00:07:58] We were on the the the main like the where they brought all the delegates in and

[00:08:03] we're like in that scene.

[00:08:07] And I remember because he comes and does that speech.

[00:08:10] And I remember speaking to him about I had just been watching like lots of different

[00:08:17] during the pandemic they released like the national theatre had recorded so many of their productions.

[00:08:23] So I just like just drunk in so many of these theatre productions.

[00:08:27] So I was just talking to him about it and I've never been to the UK and I've never been to London.

[00:08:32] I love to work on one of those stages one day.

[00:08:35] So I was just telling him how like I just admire a lot of the productions that have come out of

[00:08:41] all his own down and his his countrymen.

[00:08:45] Yeah so that is this thing that I've touched base with them on and

[00:08:49] and I would love to watch that man perform on stage.

[00:08:52] I think he's a force in general.

[00:08:56] Interesting.

[00:08:57] Yeah we I would love to see that too.

[00:09:00] Both of you perform.

[00:09:02] Yes because he was in a production or two with Patrick Stewart.

[00:09:09] David was.

[00:09:10] Yeah.

[00:09:11] Yeah he was he was he I don't want to say which takes spirit and plate.

[00:09:16] But say it against Sabrina was Ronaldo.

[00:09:19] Yes.

[00:09:20] Okay.

[00:09:20] Amazing.

[00:09:21] Yeah.

[00:09:22] I'm like oh okay.

[00:09:26] He always mentions Patrick Stewart as a force or his mentor or someone who's always championed

[00:09:34] him.

[00:09:35] So yeah so I always thought that was pretty cool.

[00:09:38] Hmm.

[00:09:39] Right.

[00:09:41] Yeah.

[00:09:42] It's incredible.

[00:09:44] Oh you see the kids.

[00:09:48] So great.

[00:09:49] I'm sorry go ahead.

[00:09:50] No I was saying Raven also was talking about the theater also and all of her

[00:09:57] all the things she's doing up in Canada so it was pretty cool seeing all three of you

[00:10:02] together and knowing that you all these theater kids.

[00:10:07] I'm from New York so you know the theater is huge for us and I just love when actors come

[00:10:12] from the theater.

[00:10:13] They seem like they're just different type of people and different type of actors.

[00:10:19] And I just I don't know they just I don't know they just they just they just in they

[00:10:26] Inveil the rules a little better you know they're most and they all wind up on law and order.

[00:10:36] It's true though.

[00:10:37] Those are some acting folks on that show.

[00:10:39] You they really are.

[00:10:41] They play they play those passing and you can you can tell the ones that come from the theater

[00:10:46] versus the ones that don't come from the theater.

[00:10:49] That's what I think that's when I was trying to explain.

[00:10:51] Okay okay.

[00:10:53] I'm trying to see it.

[00:10:57] It can be a really tough transition.

[00:10:59] It's like I really respect like film and TV actors because there's so much nuance that

[00:11:05] I also had to learn as a theater kid.

[00:11:08] Oh my gosh, I remember my first agent in South Africa RIP she since past time but

[00:11:16] I remember talking to her and I was she was just like yeah um you do a lot with your face.

[00:11:23] I was like but he needs she's like like that.

[00:11:28] And that's too much for camera.

[00:11:29] I was like oh no.

[00:11:32] No like all things like that that I guess people that are just trained and in front of

[00:11:37] a camera are used to whereas theater kids are just like every part of our body says something

[00:11:43] so used to using my body to tell a story more than words.

[00:11:49] I'd enjoy and I go back to you and I can even feel myself now having worked in TV for a few

[00:11:56] years now kind of thirsting for that avenue and my body and wanting to be in front of

[00:12:04] a live audience because I think there is a different kind of communion.

[00:12:08] I think there's something to be said about letting people put down their phones and put it on

[00:12:13] silent and having sit in a dog room and having their souls there and their hot beats there

[00:12:19] and having your hot beat there and having a shared experience and a story in a room.

[00:12:24] It's just a different thing and I yeah I'll always go back to the stage that's one thing

[00:12:31] that I can't I can't I can't leave and I don't think it'll ever leave me and I'm lucky to have

[00:12:39] have had and been birthed from it.

[00:12:43] I say it's an act of yeah.

[00:12:45] Well it didn't leave you when that first scene when you said we coming on this we coming now

[00:12:51] you got on a bridge okay sister you're bilingual and like she's in this

[00:12:59] yeah it was all there and when you talked and man Dean and I'm like oh hey listen there

[00:13:12] it's still there I tell you I saw that and of course I've seen it over and over again but

[00:13:20] every time I see it I see your command with the body language and there I see you take over the

[00:13:25] road yeah with the body language and the talking but the body language was really there oh yeah

[00:13:32] yeah mm-hmm definitely I appreciate I think you know one thing helps is costumes I mean oh yeah

[00:13:41] I should for lips is genius and yes oh god yeah that's the thing that really took my breath away

[00:13:47] about that set of discos is going in and having you know Sean and Gershane and Reid and three

[00:13:55] heads that are these black people that are just like this story and this is you know our art form

[00:14:02] and and the story we're telling and this is the medium we're using to tell it and I mean we

[00:14:07] I stood in front of Gershane for like an hour and some point in detail the menisky details

[00:14:13] and the shoes she put me in that's that's what made me stand that way the head right so you know

[00:14:22] it's like that that team effort to like that kind of costume is also due to her for sure oh okay

[00:14:30] yeah all hail Gershane Phillips like she is a queen man oh god I would just love to have her on

[00:14:38] the show sometime pick her brain too you know she's got so much respect for her so much respect

[00:14:45] to me what she's doing is she just you know we gonna sing her praises all always I have a

[00:14:52] question about your costume I just watched the episode like maybe two hours earlier because you

[00:14:57] know like for the 20th time which one like the first people of earth what people of earth

[00:15:03] oh you're a queen how quick did you know

[00:15:12] did you really girls your first is that she designed the costume and then did she meet you

[00:15:16] when it designed the costume or is it the other way around like how does it I've definitely had a

[00:15:22] sketch before I came in uh okay yeah yeah definitely she she had something already but she I had

[00:15:30] to come in about I think a week week or two weeks before so she can have an additional meat

[00:15:35] and then work around that and do alterations as quick as they could before coming on set officially

[00:15:45] yeah yeah what a uniform you want you know we can cosplay that that was like I know and I

[00:15:55] can see I can see I can see Fran and Fran are cosplaying that oh yeah with the hat with the

[00:16:01] hat and I'm not a hat person yeah that's what I have you know really funny me to have your

[00:16:10] grade that's what they wanted oh really yeah okay because they were worried that I was a bit young

[00:16:18] too young for the leadership role I loved about it because you can listen on there like I know

[00:16:25] yeah I'm gonna shoot right now she came from the uh horror training

[00:16:34] yeah you don't get this shit about the way I'm gonna shoot like do you know that's a girl

[00:16:41] right I said now that's a sister right then I'm gonna be a little bit more than you it was

[00:16:49] would you say pooh me maybe a little too trigger happy

[00:16:56] I just say it was a little history there you know lived experience right you know she like wouldn't

[00:17:04] be the one like park in her car in the city and leaving the leaving the leaving it unlocked and

[00:17:10] still leaving bags out where you can see them stuff you know like no she's the ones like uh oh

[00:17:16] no I got my city smarts on we're gonna hit this up first we're gonna hit first

[00:17:23] then they bought you back right when you and that's when you were interacting with David a lot

[00:17:30] you know and that was something we was like okay at the at the end when you uh

[00:17:37] people haven't seen this so oh yeah I mean it's my five sisters number one we don't do

[00:17:43] but we don't do the spoiler free zone everybody knows that right now yeah okay when you do it

[00:17:50] when you when you uh drove the the shuttle and everything was like okay she redeemed herself

[00:17:55] she redeemed herself the foot of the guy that she she got in together she redeemed herself

[00:17:59] we were so glad that you survived right right you you're really glad that you survived

[00:18:06] yeah right right I like that they gave you a great storyline they brought you back and gave you a

[00:18:15] very you know not not some not you weren't there for dressing you you were there and you you were

[00:18:21] um you know important to the storyline um we didn't know whether you could have made it or not

[00:18:28] it we didn't I love that that you got brought back for a significant part of the story

[00:18:34] so I mean because the when you came onto the scene I mean we were all like oh wait

[00:18:41] we weren't expecting you then we got you like give me more and then they did and they gave us

[00:18:46] more storyline not just more of you just kind of standing in the background so that was definitely

[00:18:53] appreciated a little part of the story yeah definitely yeah for me right I love that it's been a

[00:19:01] while hasn't it well I mean what I was going to ask you about um you know playing a powerful

[00:19:11] woman like in doye and then I know that you played antigony and you know um you know are these

[00:19:18] the type of roles that you really like to search out because I mean and how important it is it

[00:19:24] for you to play a role like her um you know I if I'm honest I think those roles get that's what I

[00:19:34] get cost in um and I'm okay with that I don't think it's a thing I can run from or change or escape

[00:19:43] I'm very much like happy to portray those women and um yeah I think there's something

[00:19:56] to be said about uh

[00:20:02] where their vulnerability lies that I I'm more interested in working towards finding

[00:20:10] I think I'm still I can't I can't escape those characters and I think there's more in my path

[00:20:17] and as a young actor I think what I'm curious about finding is yeah is their soft spots I think

[00:20:27] so much of and doye is Christian for um that scene that I think for me was was really

[00:20:37] my favorite but also was really tough was when um Michael and relic confranteur and you know she

[00:20:48] she really finds out for the first time that it wasn't book that she was to it really really breaks

[00:20:55] her heart uh-huh is like I think she was leading with absolute certainty that she was doing

[00:21:03] the right thing even though she was going against everyone else and I think as much von

[00:21:11] I was trying as much as possible to bring as much vulnerability because there's something about

[00:21:16] I mean we all know like you know they see a strong black woman and they don't see the humanity or

[00:21:23] the vulnerability that's behind the reasons we have to be strong and the and the and that for me is

[00:21:33] the the the mission behind those characters like if you're gonna if you're gonna throw those women

[00:21:40] on me I want to throw that about them back on you throw their vulnerability and their pain

[00:21:49] and the things that you don't see about them back on you and I it's just something that I'm

[00:21:53] I want to work towards revealing more and like the layer that I want to peel back is

[00:21:59] is what they think they know about those women. I love that

[00:22:05] I love that you know because her pain was her pain was so

[00:22:10] you know

[00:22:11] you know

[00:22:13] visible I mean it we really were heartbroken with her

[00:22:18] you know um you know we went on that journey with her and you made it

[00:22:23] you made it so real you know so so palpable that you know

[00:22:28] yeah I get that and I appreciate that because you know we do put

[00:22:33] they we do tend to get these monolithic portrayals you know the or the archetype you know

[00:22:38] I mean at least like I know like on discovery people are trying to think through those

[00:22:45] tropes right and and they're at least trying to not give us the same old same old that we always get

[00:22:51] but um I know I see what you're saying though about like people wanting to cast the strong

[00:22:58] black woman and writing the strong black woman in you know how we just it doesn't let us allow

[00:23:04] us the space to be human right yeah right and go to the right to pull that sorry

[00:23:12] yeah no kudos to the rights is for writing in the room for that um but but definitely for me I

[00:23:20] think even in orange even in that the character that I played ake is like there's so much to the

[00:23:28] the reality that these women I keep being met with these women and the roles that I'm

[00:23:33] costing in antigenies and and I I'm just curious about what it is about me and and where it is

[00:23:42] in my own life that you know the resistance or all where that bridge is between the strength

[00:23:50] and the vulnerability uh-huh toughness for myself I think is also what is interesting to bring

[00:23:57] to the character and show that transition and and that toughness in the kind of because I just

[00:24:04] think it's relatable for for anyone yeah we've all been there just not in space

[00:24:10] exactly yeah not with it something hidden towards earth you know

[00:24:25] stakes were a little bit high you know just had to make some choices yeah yeah

[00:24:32] yeah well I had a thing moment even in the first even in the one I just watched um people of earth

[00:24:39] and again you were so sure that when was a raider that they were coming to earth and that one

[00:24:47] scene like I just started again and when you just said that when they take off his helmet and you

[00:24:52] realize he's a human the look on your face was just what and I it just hit me when you said it

[00:25:00] because I just I just watched it and I said there it is again that I can't believe I've been doing

[00:25:06] this and I can't believe this is happening and you just that moment is just so right amazing

[00:25:11] that's that whole scene that was just great I'm like I just love this episode I was just really happy

[00:25:17] I got to watch it again before talking to you yeah you wise you wise

[00:25:22] you know human did you say my eyes friend eyes yes yeah I'm I you know I I sit down and I watch um to

[00:25:35] you know I watch stuff but I look at I go below the surface you know and in what people are doing

[00:25:43] or portraying and your eyes because you have beautiful eyes and they're so expressive and when

[00:25:49] you said that like Sabrina said oh wait a minute we've been it was believable it's like when

[00:25:56] you said you're human you know and and in your eyes I saw oh my gosh we've been wrong and these

[00:26:04] are our people and I just saw it in your eyes so the whole thing right and the whole thing what are

[00:26:09] we gonna do now and make up for it like we saw the whole conversation yeah that's that yeah

[00:26:19] I'm so glad because that that is definitely my one thing that I'm like every time I watch like

[00:26:26] I mean I don't like watching when I do I'm like my eyes are too big I can't stand it how do I

[00:26:32] don't know I don't have a great big David said I don't even know if I was telling him that my

[00:26:40] eyes were my insecurities specifically but he said something about like whatever you think is the

[00:26:46] thing that's like your thing that you don't like or the one thing that you're trying to change

[00:26:52] like he was like he was saying something about like lean into that like that's in that people probably

[00:26:57] love the most about that so listen to me now like my eyes and I know

[00:27:08] that wasn't gonna say anything about eyes not him oh yeah those eyes he has yeah

[00:27:22] David John yeah

[00:27:27] well I so I have I was thinking about something and please tell me like if I'm wrong and

[00:27:34] I'm just sort of interested because you come from a place and living in this country as a black person

[00:27:46] it's like you're most often one of minority in most places where we live like I've been blessed to

[00:27:56] grow up in DC which is chocolate city and live around a lot of other black people right but a lot

[00:28:03] of us don't get the option the good fortune to live around a lot of black people but you growing up

[00:28:11] you're in South Africa you're around a lot of other black people you're learning to act there

[00:28:17] you're getting on the stage there and you're starting to tell stories to a lot of other black people

[00:28:23] right but then in this country and like and and the reason I was thinking about this because I was

[00:28:29] thinking about like every time I write like sometimes like I'm writing going who's my audience right

[00:28:34] like like I remember one of my writing classes like I've write I was writing a story and it was very

[00:28:41] like based in the South where my family is and where I'm from and this white teacher of mine was

[00:28:48] like I don't understand this word and I don't understand that word and I found myself like really

[00:28:52] writing the story before I caught myself so that she could understand it instead of just writing

[00:28:57] it to the audience that it's meant for right um into my culture and I was just wondering if you

[00:29:05] I know this is a really roundabout sort of hodgepodge way to say because I don't have like the

[00:29:09] thoughts completely formulated about it but like playing roles telling stories in South Africa

[00:29:19] or in a majority black space versus telling stories here in a country where black people um

[00:29:27] are not the majority like is there a difference in how you approach the roles or does it I mean

[00:29:33] does it make a difference um do you feel that difference at all? I think I do I think I do

[00:29:45] given that my first two roles were American women on such vast spectrums of reality

[00:29:53] you had this woman working in a law firm um fight as dealt with the persistent and then you had

[00:30:00] a prisoner right for kids who's in maximum security probably for the rest of her life

[00:30:08] and then this South African girl who's farman or black experience not all black but like

[00:30:15] like entering into these women's experiences so stepping into Ngoia was also very trippy for me

[00:30:25] because I was playing South African while speaking with my accent or whatever I actually find

[00:30:31] those roles kind of harder to do it's kind of easier to step into someone else's shoes

[00:30:37] um well it was I was happy to do it because she was captured of earth and I was in space so yeah

[00:30:43] it's been far away for myself but having those two women be like my first like branch into like

[00:30:54] especially the TV film industry was actually such a gift in and of itself especially here in this

[00:31:01] country because I got to understand so much of an experience I yes you're like you're saying that

[00:31:07] I didn't grow up in and I think I've come to understand that I I I mean granted the black

[00:31:19] experience for me is it'll always be universal yes I'm from a majority black country but I'm still

[00:31:26] from a country that I mean I part of it was five minutes ago right and I'm from a country that

[00:31:34] as much as the white people are in a minority there's still so much white leadership in a sense and

[00:31:42] um-hmm many white people in some sort of financial power yeah that you're still an imbalance

[00:31:49] that is very similar to what I experienced living here yeah I feel like the only difference is

[00:31:56] it's a weird numbers thing in terms of visually um that said

[00:32:06] me it's I don't know there was a clarification of like we're one and of the same being in those

[00:32:18] shoes I and that sounds like a cop out but it really did feel like such a

[00:32:25] stepping towards myself being in their shoes especially when it came to ages I I specifically

[00:32:32] resonated with her because I did very minimal but somewhat work in in prisons back home and so did

[00:32:44] my dad and there was something about that I just are often feel I mean I was working with

[00:32:52] men's prison shooting boys that I often just would always look at them like oh that's that's my

[00:32:58] that's my life that could be my nephew or my I don't know my boy cousin uh-huh

[00:33:05] I was stepping into eight years I was just like this could definitely be me I had my mom sneeze

[00:33:12] differently one day like the spectrum is like it's a cough away yeah in terms of reality so I just

[00:33:23] it I just felt like those roles just took me a step closer to who I could have been

[00:33:30] another world or who I am in another world um yeah so and that's I think what makes what

[00:33:40] I am lucky to do so powerful I get I get to step towards a reality of often experience that

[00:33:51] I feel like I I wouldn't get to have but I do share uh-huh he says it does it does

[00:34:01] it makes complete sense yeah so as much as it it's far it just felt it felt very

[00:34:10] very close that makes sense that was really yeah interesting because I think like

[00:34:17] I mean across the diaspora right across the the African diaspora around what we all have um

[00:34:27] in the in the in the core of us we have a shared experience

[00:34:32] yeah um even though for a lot of it can look it can look different on the surface

[00:34:40] yeah yeah and I just say and I and I'm just always interested um you know I don't often get to talk

[00:34:46] to people who grew up in a different place right for me and um so I'm always interested

[00:34:54] from black people from anywhere around the world like what is it like how are you interpreting

[00:35:00] this you know like what is it that because American racism can be a really specific thing um culturally

[00:35:06] you know and so but I'm always you know but colonization is colonization yeah that's universal

[00:35:15] in a sense so I'm always interested in you know other people's experiences from other places

[00:35:22] that said I mean there's also so much research that has to go into those roles that's as much

[00:35:29] as there's a familiarity and there's the universal understanding uh-huh so much that that sits

[00:35:38] us apart that you have to do the work to discover you know you they you can't have any assumptions

[00:35:45] that you think you know a cause experience as African I like I can't even begin to understand

[00:35:54] her experience and that's where I as the actor have to do the work um to understand and

[00:36:01] that that takes a lot of work and a lot of research and a lot of unpacking and questioning

[00:36:07] and you and you learn as you stay in it and you learn from your peers and you ask questions and

[00:36:13] you continue to stay in it and and what I love about other actors especially like behind the scenes

[00:36:20] is they they they help you in conversation if you open to it someone like Delroy Lindo was like

[00:36:27] that was my first job ever he just like you are just he is a wealth of knowledge and explanation

[00:36:38] and like generosity of spirit I remember once I was learning a Shakespeare monologue

[00:36:45] and he looked over at me and he was just like you got no dish at it but I was like yeah

[00:36:52] my important audition on a professional set

[00:36:56] again you know a different next week and he's like you like you like theater and I was like

[00:37:00] enough theater and he was like thank you should do theater I was like yeah but I mean it's

[00:37:05] beating with this I would never do that and he's like I don't know if you really want to do the

[00:37:09] theater I think you should do it over this wow like just that one sentence was so liberating I was

[00:37:16] just like I learned these lines out loud right still thing that was really liberating for a better

[00:37:24] way the leader of the show to like give me permission to learn my lines out like not they are not hiding

[00:37:31] he was just like do it if you want to do it you know because he knew the

[00:37:35] rigidity of that goal so I don't know how interesting I love him yeah I do too I was looking at

[00:37:44] get shorty the other day yesterday and he was something in there too I like him

[00:37:52] I just I just I'd like I like I like the stories of us nurturing us you know and really being there

[00:38:03] for each other you know and yeah and especially you know a veteran somebody with the so much

[00:38:11] experience just giving it away and saying like okay it's your generation is coming up next you're

[00:38:19] the person coming up next you know and let me impart to you what I can go for right you know

[00:38:27] go for it I love that I love that oh my god um that's just you just got my brain like just going

[00:38:38] in so many different directions there I'm really like I love talking to you about your experience

[00:38:46] and and um you know that character acres on orange and blue black shoes amazing really powerful I

[00:38:53] mean like you just played the hell out of her you know and uh god you are so deeply talented

[00:39:01] and I can't wait to see like what is coming up next for you you know do you have stuff that's

[00:39:10] coming up next that you can talk about do I do I can I talk about it and maybe

[00:39:20] if you can yeah do it oh no she's like do it do it do it did you find one of those things

[00:39:28] you didn't find that in the end I don't want to get you in trouble all right we're gonna get

[00:39:33] nobody in trouble now because once you to come back so we don't want to get you in trouble

[00:39:37] so when you're doing it we can do you know into the you know talk to you again

[00:39:41] gosh now I I really don't know so maybe I shouldn't say because I go okay yeah okay okay

[00:39:49] that makes sense we gotta work she knows I'm not spiking everything a couple of things have been delayed

[00:39:57] but I did shoot I shot two different things one till the end of last year which it was quite fun

[00:40:04] it is shot here in LA which was interesting because I've lived here two years now um so it was

[00:40:11] nice to shoot shoot something yeah go home yeah yeah and it was a good chunky little fun

[00:40:20] thing uh but it's challenging but was was cool and then there's something that I did a

[00:40:28] just one episode on that was just one of my favorite experiences ever I worked with the

[00:40:34] director that is is very very incredible and it was one of those experiences and there's

[00:40:42] black male lead who you're all here about when it comes out whatever um and hopefully they

[00:40:49] can't cut me out of that one I actually know that they can't cut me out yay I know I'm in it

[00:40:58] but but it was one of those things it was like watching him work man god I love that people

[00:41:09] it was like watching him take his space as like also he's also a theater accent just like watching

[00:41:18] him like just take his spaces like a lead of a show and just like be direct be flexible and play

[00:41:27] and getting to work with him and like it was like similar to working with David and his generosity

[00:41:33] and his like care and his like taking people in and like seeing the crew and I don't know I just

[00:41:41] I love arriving to a set where the number one similar to sneak work is like so if of this

[00:41:48] simply kind and like talented and like committed to the work but also committed to like being

[00:41:56] present for everyone I don't know how you balance that I just know like I pray if if you can even

[00:42:04] not say if when when that is my situation that I'm able to like handle it with the grace that

[00:42:13] they do because I think specifically for us as black people we're just put under such a microscope

[00:42:19] and I just remember like it's just sending rays of energy out towards him like from my

[00:42:26] thought just being like I just hope he can just feel being held as well being held back

[00:42:35] because he's just so much holding of everyone else that I just is just really inspiring and it

[00:42:40] was just such a beautiful beautiful sit and experience with a photo it was like my it was my

[00:42:47] my favorite thing since discovery I'll say that for the year for sure so happy for you for that

[00:42:55] yeah that's all right doesn't this sounds so good I don't know what it is but I'll be looking out for

[00:43:01] it's not come back and talk to us when it comes out would you please

[00:43:05] there's nothing like going to a place where you love to work

[00:43:10] hey nothing like it I'm sorry what were you saying sorry no I was just saying it's

[00:43:15] turning everyone into so bad it was so special for me I just really loved every moment of it

[00:43:20] and everything about those people I just I hope it goes really well for the rest of whatever

[00:43:27] they're doing with it and all of that's done nice yeah we'll be looking we'll be looking for

[00:43:33] that of course I just love how you speaking about like the the generosity of you know like these

[00:43:44] people that we look up to I mean it's they're so important because you will like we have these

[00:43:49] role models now you know and just you know just like like Sunikwa for instance just by

[00:43:55] the number of people that we've talked to from disco everybody says the same exact thing yeah

[00:44:03] like now I have a role model in my own life for my own leadership you know like when I have to

[00:44:11] be in a leadership position and you know it's super important to the trickle down you know the work

[00:44:16] like you said like we look like people but we have a lot on us there's a lot a lot on us but to be

[00:44:23] able to be in that position and being that position with grace you know is it it's a blessing right

[00:44:32] that should be the same such a blessing and it's it's just a tough I think it's just a tough thing

[00:44:38] and the big old Hollywood it's it there's a there's a it's just a different energy director

[00:44:50] yeah yeah I don't think I'm built for that no I'll stay right here in DC thank you very much

[00:45:01] yeah I don't know how you guys do it but I'm glad that you're out there doing it because that's a lot

[00:45:07] the tape I would never get in the roles you know I'm like don't anybody back again

[00:45:17] I'll be a say you be just and everybody yeah I was

[00:45:22] you know I would be really acting and all that but you know when it comes down to the politics

[00:45:27] or stuff I'd be like huh really you're gonna do this you're gonna you know

[00:45:35] hear my face and try to tell me it's raining no I couldn't make it I barely make it where I'm at

[00:45:43] but they like me so I hey what can I say I have a completely unrelated question okay and not

[00:45:53] and not so serious like this one is just I'm interested in to know like because trick fans we are

[00:46:00] so rabid yeah we could be like you know what how was how did you find your reception into

[00:46:14] the trick world like how did people treat you when you came in because I know we were excited as

[00:46:20] help like you rocked our worlds when we saw you and when you took on this role and I'm just

[00:46:26] wondering how people have been behaving towards you I hope very well yeah good I have since kind of

[00:46:36] come off social media like I deleted the Twitter I did when I did have Twitter it was pretty chill

[00:46:43] go like that all I've heard about Cypher such a sort of and then like there was some like

[00:46:51] merma's about doing and like but like my people back home were more defensive about me than like I was

[00:47:02] could be you did like yeah but I don't I feel like I feel like it was fine I don't know I die yeah

[00:47:10] I don't remember any nothing jumps out at me that was like

[00:47:18] yeah neither good nor like bad but like who's mostly like just like yeah what's chill

[00:47:27] they're like there's like a like a like a couple more followers on Instagram a couple more and

[00:47:33] Twitter pretty chill you know I mean I was thinking that for the most I mean for the most part

[00:47:46] of we check fans like we love we just spread a lot of love for the most part you know we have a

[00:47:53] few trolls out there but the majority of us are out there like sending good vibes out into the

[00:48:00] world and you know I just know like from our peer group you know how how big love it you are

[00:48:07] how the love of the role was like maybe we automatically like your ours now and you know

[00:48:15] we don't care what other role you ever get you were your transfer part of track whatever you're trying

[00:48:20] you know whatever especially on that season three I was just like oh my gosh

[00:48:31] and I love I love your gap in your teeth thank you

[00:48:35] I'm trying to say I'm trying to say with the Nigerian say so I'm claiming she my cousin too okay

[00:48:51] hey y'all don't y'all know me that's what I do my cousin my cousin my cousin

[00:48:59] well I have a question sure I heard earlier when you first got the gig you said that you

[00:49:08] were had not really seen you weren't familiar with Star Trek ahead and see them but so since

[00:49:14] you've done season five now have you watched any other Star Trek they have you more familiar

[00:49:20] with Star Trek besides Discovery the sides Discovery yeah

[00:49:29] yeah you know what though I'm about to like go in on Picard because my friend is really good friend

[00:49:37] Ashley she probably shit she's not oh I say the name messed up but

[00:49:43] I can never say it's funny but she is on it and you guys should get her off this podcast she's the

[00:49:50] most amazing human being ever she plays the Robert and Storter yes yes we would love to get

[00:49:57] her believe I am trying I am trying if you know what you know her you know her

[00:50:03] yeah I'll be sure to be textured today yeah yeah I appreciate you but she I have to I have to watch

[00:50:12] all the scenes so I need to stop but I need to start from the beginning I'm kind of like I have a

[00:50:16] slight OCDs I can't like watch just her because I was gonna say like honestly you're really down

[00:50:24] you really don't it depends on what you mean by from the beginning you could you like watch

[00:50:31] the whole season three yeah you don't need to go season one no you can watch the whole thing but

[00:50:41] she's only in season three okay so here's a thing but that's why I was gonna stop in season one

[00:50:46] oh yeah okay well okay so here's the thing I'm not saying don't do I'm not saying I can't tell

[00:50:52] people how to enjoy their trick yeah I'm just gonna say yes season one and season two

[00:50:59] first of all don't have squat to do with each other and then season one and two don't have

[00:51:07] squat to do with season three you don't need to watch those two seasons at all right I like all

[00:51:15] three seasons right so what's going on you know it's you know odd is subjective that's right yeah

[00:51:21] that's right exactly Fran is a big fan of all three seasons I am me not me not so much story I know

[00:51:29] how you feel Fran this is yeah I mean there's a lot of there's a lot of like some of the backstory

[00:51:35] like honestly like they don't even carry in for that much backstory from those see I'm telling you

[00:51:41] it's like completely different now I'm not saying they're not worth it like a season one we season one

[00:51:47] we the front me and Fran and Sabrina did our one of some of our first shows talking about season one

[00:51:54] of Picard and in those shows we were geeking out over and I'd like so I still like I really like

[00:52:00] season one yeah I'm just saying that they don't relate like seasons one two and three aren't

[00:52:06] necessarily related it's just like they're in the same universe but but they're not like this

[00:52:12] story building on this story building on this story you know um it's their very different

[00:52:19] individually different seasons altogether different right characters huh I don't need to

[00:52:27] know anything about the characters for season three like I mean yeah like that I mean like no like

[00:52:34] there's really no there's no there's no characters that survive except for Picard and like

[00:52:41] there's only one or two kids there's only a couple of characters that make it through all

[00:52:48] that from season one to season three so there's character development between Rafi and Seven

[00:52:54] it is character development with Picard I wasn't yeah I mean but I mean I'm just saying I'm saying

[00:53:02] is that they're not necessarily thematically connected you can't stop with three though you can

[00:53:07] start with three yeah you want to go and go back yeah you can do it that way yeah that's a good

[00:53:14] idea what I'll just just I like throw in if I were to if you started at three no no no outside

[00:53:23] of sorry outside of Picard oh outside of Picard which one these things yeah yeah

[00:53:29] these things yeah that's it all what season should she look at no no no no you start from season one

[00:53:40] okay you will enjoy season five the best but let me tell you you know that season one the

[00:53:47] emissary the best pilot of Star Trek ever yes you say it's time yes I mean we gotta

[00:53:54] face every brooks every brooks every brooks every brooks that's all I gotta say every brooks

[00:54:01] theater person yes yes she experienced theater that whole cast is or theater amazing right

[00:54:07] the non-visitor right right right right now vineo version why like I mean oh my god all this goes on

[00:54:14] fantastic no my problem is I watch a lot of reality TV I struggle with straight story white so

[00:54:20] this is the way we get into some stocks let me tell you you know let me tell you're gonna be

[00:54:25] writing us and you could be like girls I watched that pilot watch that pilot that pilot is part

[00:54:35] of the only pilot that will that will keep everything in that pilot is in that whole

[00:54:41] that whole series mm-hmm every as you go through it you're like oh that's in the pilot that's

[00:54:47] the pilot yeah it's it's a little it's a little hard the summer summer season one is a little

[00:54:53] hard but there's a lot of little nuggets and there's some really some really good episodes in there

[00:54:59] it's some really crazy ones but also winners on that cast I mean that's that's the show that's

[00:55:05] the show season one is like the thesis like you see someone is like the thesis I mean I've been

[00:55:10] the pilot is like the thesis statement and everything else flowed from there and you know it was

[00:55:18] it was so intentional there was such amazing world building there's such incredible character

[00:55:24] development on that show and it just like the writing is some of the best we've ever still to this

[00:55:30] day have ever seen start track yeah and the act three and make a lot of sense would you say

[00:55:38] yeah when she watches Picard three space nine is gonna make a lot of sense to you because you've

[00:55:45] already seen this space nine I'm excited for you try to start with though do I start with no

[00:55:59] no stop stop Picard stop with your friend because she's so good for

[00:56:05] you like she's I mean we're talking Ashley Ashley she is phenomenal like she out of the

[00:56:13] world she is like this most beautiful human being ever yes please please please because I've

[00:56:22] been trying to get paramount can't be an interview with her email it's definitely I

[00:56:27] I mean she's yeah until she's got some sisters out here who just absolutely adore her because we do

[00:56:34] I mean she is really holding her own with those veterans yeah I mean like really commanding your

[00:56:41] commanding your your attention on that screen and I mean she's just phenomenal I love her and I was

[00:56:47] like because I was thinking even before they started talking about this hashtag legacy track thing

[00:56:52] you know whatever like advocate you know I was just like I was looking at her as like I have got to

[00:56:57] see her in more Star Trek yeah absolutely yeah she she should be in more Trek yes there should be

[00:57:05] no more as a prominent character as one of the lead characters yeah absolutely as the pilot of

[00:57:11] the enterprise right she is a pilot yeah that's not an engineer nope it's a pilot yeah you and all

[00:57:19] of this is going to make sense once you watch this when you watch that thing see you have a

[00:57:24] see you three so excited you're pleased it's gonna be so good I'm telling you I'm telling you

[00:57:35] I kiss this is our mission to bring the more people in the world we can't

[00:57:40] yes you look you're gonna be email and that's like look okay watch the emissary it was dope

[00:57:50] like this is every email and then you can be like oh I watched season three and then it was

[00:57:56] dope and then you will be like do it oh my god oh my god oh good do wet is in season two

[00:58:04] yes season two right yeah one of the most incredible episodes yeah it's incredible

[00:58:09] oh it'll make you cry it'll make it oh my gosh do wet season two nano visitors and just she

[00:58:16] just knocks it out the park yeah and what they did on D space nine they did arc before aquas popular

[00:58:24] they did it so it is easy is it is a great episode to bend I mean excuse me a gate a great

[00:58:31] series series then it's not a I mean they do independent stories of course but there's a connection

[00:58:39] and overall arc to what they do and it's great for the way people look at TV today yeah we did that

[00:58:47] back like 20 years ago I mean I mean 30 years ago 30 years ago we're celebrating the 30 years

[00:58:54] this whole this whole year so we've had a lot of them on the show yeah I don't want to admit 30 years ago

[00:59:01] okay I do hey we start here right no but you know I don't you know I still think the 70s were 30

[00:59:08] years ago oh and I know I get caught in that time warp sometimes too yeah that's right oh

[00:59:15] count my fingers they wait that's what we oh yeah I don't why don't count it just leave it be

[00:59:25] I made it to 52 and I'm so damn happy about it I'm glad in everything but I still

[00:59:31] there yeah just the baby she's the baby of the bunch

[00:59:41] she's the baby of the bunch Sabrina and I watched TOS the original series when it first

[00:59:48] permeate on TV what's in the mid oh gosh yeah I'm original you know you who are

[00:59:59] the OS yeah we saw it and now we're watching you yep yes and we're still watching it

[01:00:06] do that's right do as happy that is amazing it pretty much isn't wow

[01:00:18] I had made look like you please god man girl come on you know

[01:00:26] you already got the gem we have a firm black don't crack you know

[01:00:31] come on happyness of watching Star Trek that's it isn't it is a happy life

[01:00:37] let's see this is what I'm saying like you are part when people say you're a part of the Star Trek

[01:00:41] family when you are 52 and 60 years still gonna be working conventions and people are still

[01:00:47] gonna be happy to see you and we're still gonna love you for the role that you played and that's

[01:00:51] it is you never we are never gonna let you go you did the golden girls tell about the golden

[01:01:01] girls you there at intracal and island they have the golden girls from the first series from

[01:01:05] the original series they were on the state they was still talking Star Trek that's right

[01:01:11] and it was full and everybody knew who they were and we were so excited oh my god

[01:01:17] okay listening audience I just wish you could see Pumis face right now because it's so delighted

[01:01:24] and full of wonder and this big smile I would be seven these still talking this show

[01:01:32] how do I fall to go

[01:01:37] Koreans you know they have they got this meme out this says oh Star Trek is this is years ago

[01:01:42] Star Trek has been out for 50 years now and it had all these little things and

[01:01:45] tell my and that also means that we have 60 year old Trekkies I put it up there I said I feel

[01:01:51] personally attacked because they had the guy looking all you know old and but no you know just

[01:02:00] look at old look at all mister you know okay here's what was funny though like okay so Pumis I've

[01:02:06] watched that one interview that you did I mean there's this one interview like on YouTube and you

[01:02:10] were talking about how they wanted like the character in doye is supposed to be in her 40s right

[01:02:16] right but they wanted to gray up her hair and I was like why did you bring her hair she's only 40 something

[01:02:22] like what the Jesus come on y'all

[01:02:27] because they were finding a way to age me and I'm like you need to look at black women that are

[01:02:34] 40 they look like I look

[01:02:39] what's that group say

[01:02:45] gray but it's same that's not gonna do

[01:02:50] like they don't do they not understand black people

[01:02:54] and that's the one thing that Jonathan was like what'd you think about this does like no

[01:02:58] and he's like yeah that's that this is serious it does not

[01:03:03] like no need it you know Jonathan you like jump off it and and that's why I even when you know

[01:03:10] read and Sean or we're doing it in the makeup trailer they were like this we just got to show them

[01:03:15] what they want to see

[01:03:29] okay I feel like well I'll definitely look for the photo and I will send it to you guys

[01:03:40] I look ridiculous

[01:03:45] costumes right now that's cosplay

[01:03:50] right and I love your haircut

[01:03:53] by the way the haircuts the hair was one it wasn't

[01:03:56] I love that haircut look at that so so hand look at

[01:03:59] we know it's everything

[01:04:01] now all that all the short-haired women we were like

[01:04:03] oh

[01:04:05] I'm like

[01:04:06] like

[01:04:08] I

[01:04:10] love it

[01:04:12] oh my god pull me we can stay and talk to you all night I mean you are such a

[01:04:16] delight and such a joy and I'm your folks out there I mean this woman's heart is big

[01:04:22] and she gives energy and love and it lights up the whole room and we thank you so much for being

[01:04:28] here thank you so much for having me it's been such a joy and

[01:04:35] the next fun thing with you

[01:04:37] yes

[01:04:38] to the next fun thing so if that you want to tell folks where they can reach us for

[01:04:44] if they have thoughts on on green up aging black people before

[01:04:53] because they just bitter

[01:04:54] that would be crazy

[01:04:55] cracking everywhere but ours is not

[01:04:57] getting nailed for it

[01:04:59] I think we should have been good

[01:05:03] oh lord I gotta send us mail like that

[01:05:08] it's not my fault you know spend too much time in the sun trying to look like us and then

[01:05:12] you should start cracking okay

[01:05:14] let's not my fault

[01:05:23] this is what we do okay I'm sorry that was mean oh yeah that was

[01:05:28] I was

[01:05:28] I got to read this

[01:05:30] I'm a bit

[01:05:31] testy

[01:05:33] I'm sorry

[01:05:33] all right

[01:05:34] I have a true but it was a bit testy

[01:05:37] okay you can find us at sci-fi sisters.com

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[01:06:27] after listening to this podcast please rate us and write a review

[01:06:33] we wait we just read it on the up next

[01:06:36] up next episode

[01:06:38] that's all right i got you says on here for you

[01:06:41] we may just read it on an upcoming episode

[01:06:45] we might

[01:06:48] we don't want to hear about your melanin deficiency

[01:06:51] no they don't

[01:06:52] i'm not telling any deficiency i don't know

[01:06:55] and y'all we gotta think the baddest engineer in all and any universes

[01:06:58] that's dosed the anonymous one he's responsible for the music you hear on our show

[01:07:03] as well as our dosed dosed dosed

[01:07:09] as well as our engineering production services skills but you know what i'm trying to say y'all

[01:07:15] i gotta go it's tired i'm late

[01:07:17] it's fired it i'm late

[01:07:22] it's bad only all right man

[01:07:24] dosed is it kind of

[01:07:28] um is to cram it dosed underscore the anonymous underscore the number one we love y'all

[01:07:34] peace loving here grease goodnight people's

[01:07:38] hi everybody sister to me here with the shorty shoutouts for this month

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