Star Trek: Discovery CANCELED

[00:00:00] Greetings Star Trek fans and welcome to this special edition of Discovering Trek, The Star Trek Universe Companion.

[00:00:06] I'm your host Bill Smith for this very special episode with Breaking News, and I'm joined by two great podcasters from the Trek Geeks Podcast Network.

[00:00:15] First, our host of Kahn Pod here on the Trek Geeks Network, the Star Trek Convention Podcast, Ron Robel-Rohn. It's good to have you aboard.

[00:00:23] Thank you for having me. What a day.

[00:00:25] What a day.

[00:00:26] What a day. And of course, our friend Mike Bovia, co-host of both the Divine Treasury and Discovering Trek Prodigy, Mike. It's good to have you here, buddy.

[00:00:35] Well I took the invitation because I heard Dan wasn't going to be here so...

[00:00:38] It makes him for a great podcast for everybody. Let me tell you.

[00:00:43] No, Dan, we're missing him tonight. Obviously he's off doing other things because this is kind of a short notice deal.

[00:00:50] Major news today from Paramount Plus and the official Star Trek account.

[00:00:55] Star Trek Discovery has... I'm going to start using this word because it's essentially true, has been canceled.

[00:01:02] And we'll end with the forthcoming season five, the start of which has been delayed until 2024.

[00:01:11] And Ron, this means when season five premieres, it will have been two calendar years since we've seen Star Trek Discovery.

[00:01:20] Absolutely. And I mean, I did see there was an article in the variety that was saying they're pushing it back to 2024

[00:01:29] to give the cast a chance to come back and film some more content.

[00:01:32] So it sounds like it at least won't be a sopranos type ending. We're going to have some finality in this series.

[00:01:38] But yeah, two years is an awful long time, especially given the fact we don't know what the rest of 2023's calendar looks like with new Trek releases.

[00:01:47] Yeah. And Mike, this will mean that two different Star Trek series, both live action, will have concluded in really the span of just over a year from each other.

[00:01:58] It's been a long time since we've seen a Trek series go away and now two major ones are disappearing from the schedule.

[00:02:05] Yeah, and it's interesting because there's been so much and rightfully so so much talk about season three of the card and how it's it's the final season.

[00:02:16] But that was planned that way.

[00:02:18] Right.

[00:02:19] They said from the beginning three seasons pretty much.

[00:02:23] And so it feels like cards going out on a bang and hopefully they don't let Discovery go out on a whimper.

[00:02:32] And I think that's really the fear. I mean Star Trek Discovery is the cornerstone of modern Star Trek, you know, without it none of these other shows happen.

[00:02:42] We don't see Picard we don't see Strange into Worlds we don't see prodigy or lower decks.

[00:02:48] And we certainly wouldn't see the announcement of section 31, which by the way now I'm convinced will never happen but I was convinced of that before this all common bring Michelle you win.

[00:03:00] Well, by the time they bring her in she could be Oscar winner Michelle you know.

[00:03:05] And wouldn't that be awesome for her.

[00:03:08] And for us but I still don't think we're going to get section 31 especially now.

[00:03:14] This comes on the heels of yesterday's announcement that Paramount was going to announce streaming spending cuts run.

[00:03:23] I don't think any of us thought that it would mean that Discovery would wrap early because we were expecting season six to go before the camera is starting this fall.

[00:03:33] And it seems Paramount plus was kind of built.

[00:03:36] I've been a subscriber to Paramount plus from well before Star Trek was being utilized on the channel.

[00:03:42] And I was a brother fan and that was the only way to see the live feeds.

[00:03:45] But really the network really launched it.

[00:03:49] They start promoting it really heavily with Star Trek and Discovery was the big push so it feels like they've built this entire network around the Star Trek franchise.

[00:03:57] So when I read this article that they were going to do in cuts you know yes but not to Star Trek, not to their 10 post.

[00:04:05] It's interesting you know I was also reading none of these streaming platforms allegedly are making any money they're all costing the networks more money than their spending.

[00:04:13] You look at these Star Trek shows as incredible as they are the special effects.

[00:04:17] I'm sure they're not cheap shows to produce so I can see executives looking at it saying well hey let's cut one of these big heavy shows despite the fact that every Trekkie I know has Paramount plus right now.

[00:04:28] Yeah and as well as many other streaming services too.

[00:04:33] You know you figure that it's like like Ron just said these shows aren't cheap to produce it's part of the reason we get 10 episodes seasons.

[00:04:40] It's part of the reason that we see more shows rather than more episodes of shows.

[00:04:46] But Mike I have to believe that with so many big names being signed streaming shows that also has to have affected some of this.

[00:04:56] I mean you've got Sylvester Stallone doing a show in Kevin Costner and Harrison Ford.

[00:05:02] I was thinking the same thing because you know you look at it from the one perspective where Paramount's actually done a pretty good job over the last few years at bringing new content to the channel.

[00:05:15] And not just bring it to the channel, to the service.

[00:05:20] Right and not just throwing the same old stuff that they had back when they first opened the doors to CBS all access.

[00:05:32] So you look at it from that perspective and you say how can they be doing some of this in what the cost but as Ron said you know all of these streaming services now seem to be.

[00:05:44] The way that they're making money is selling their own product to another streaming service so that they have the rights to run it and you know the subscription service is almost like.

[00:05:58] Probably the bottom of the tick sheet at the end of the day.

[00:06:03] I think it's your guys thoughts on a few questions here that I think we're just kind of making the rounds.

[00:06:09] Do you guys think that discovery is being short changed here?

[00:06:15] Ron, I guess we can start with you.

[00:06:17] Yeah, so I love all start track.

[00:06:20] I absolutely love it.

[00:06:21] I've seen every episode of Discovery several times but having said that I think discovery of all the series that are out there including the lower ones or the animated series.

[00:06:31] It's at a point where their story could very easily be wrapped up.

[00:06:36] I think in the modern age of streaming services, very few series get five seasons and you know discovery is going to do that.

[00:06:44] I think we're past the point of 722 or 26 episodes seasons.

[00:06:48] We're not going to see that so as a Trekkie it feels like we're getting short changed but in reality I think discovery has given us some fantastic stories.

[00:06:58] It's also had some challenges.

[00:07:00] I think it makes sense that if we're going to sunset a show, it's time to do it with one of the shows that's been out there longest now for even if it is only five years.

[00:07:09] What about you Mike? Do you think discoveries getting short changed here?

[00:07:12] I'm thinking kind of along the same lines of what Ron was thinking.

[00:07:16] It was the tent post of this service and of bringing Star Trek back to the small screen.

[00:07:25] And it's had a good run.

[00:07:29] Five seasons goes back to 2017 so we're talking six years of production as well.

[00:07:39] I feel that it's being short changed by the same hand just because like Ron said, you know I love seeing new Star Trek.

[00:07:50] Whether or not it's the best episode has been put out or not.

[00:07:54] You know I get excited every time I know that there's new content coming out.

[00:07:59] But I can't it I really hope that they weren't bowing to the fact that discovery does take a lot of hits when it comes to media.

[00:08:12] I think the only reason that discovery really has taken most hits in this case is because it was the first one out there and so it's like people just have a longer track record of hating at this point if that's what their position is.

[00:08:25] Sure I can appreciate that I definitely think that discovery is getting short change to I mean there was a sixth season on the board and plan to some extent.

[00:08:35] I mean Wilson crew said not long ago that they were planning on on reporting back this fall potentially to start shooting so as far as I know the cast was not only ready but willing to go back and do yet another season of this and why not because it's great star trek and we love to watch it.

[00:08:53] I think that's really what's lost here now maybe some semblance of that will make its way into what becomes season five maybe instead of 10 episodes maybe we get 13 or 14 to kind of wrap it up.

[00:09:08] I think that would be kind of nice but I think it's hard to create an effective ending for this series since really they're kind of I get I feel like they're cobbling it together kind of at the end just so I can't say that.

[00:09:22] I think that's really the kind of ending for this season.

[00:09:25] I don't know if you're kind of at the end just to let it have a good buy does that make sense?

[00:09:30] Yeah and you know sorry I don't need to cut you off on.

[00:09:34] You know you're fine.

[00:09:37] You know going back to what you were saying about Wilson crews I mean M and I were just at far point convention down in Maryland and it is a much smaller convention than anything we're all used to go into.

[00:09:50] I mean I think that's really just chat with the stars because they've they're sitting there just taking it all in so you know it was a non official interview that we kind of did with them when we were standing there talking to them.

[00:10:04] And yet he said season six we're going back in September we've already had it scheduled out for us.

[00:10:11] Season five we're all done with on screen production it's just post production now and he said that he was actually going to LA.

[00:10:20] But he said within like a week and a half to do ADR.

[00:10:25] You know so when you're at that point with your with your actors I mean you are really just wrapping it up in the finishing touches on things to make sure that.

[00:10:36] You know it's it's it's ready for the big screen so to speak so yeah when I saw that today I was very very shot.

[00:10:48] I think to you mentioned that I've been filming a six season we have a lot of friends on the Star Trek crews right now and I literally just got a message from somebody who I don't know if they were in a panel or they were talking to Doug Jones.

[00:10:59] But I guess he only found out about the cancellation today as well wow so I have to assume if you heard it that way other members of the cast may as well so it looks like it may have been a very quick.

[00:11:10] Announcement that wasn't thought out far in advance or wasn't.

[00:11:14] Yeah well unfortunately like a lot of series cancellations and they're not using that word.

[00:11:21] But I think anytime you stop a series before it can produce more episodes and they were planning on producing more episodes it is effectively a cancellation.

[00:11:32] And based on Paramounts report that they wanted to cut costs I'm guessing budget has a lot to do with it quite honestly.

[00:11:41] You guys think that we that that a streaming audience would show up for more Star Trek if it were not as epic you know the shows that we've seen in the last six years have been this tremendous scale as far as live action Star Trek.

[00:12:00] And it's like watching a feature film every week if they simplified it more and made everything not so you know end of the galaxy do you think that a streaming audience would latch on to Star Trek just as much today as it did 30 years ago.

[00:12:15] Ron how about you.

[00:12:17] I do I think I think a majority of the people have been watching to starvary and all of the new track shows are the same group of people that watched every episode of 90s air track who have seen the original series several times.

[00:12:28] You know there's a lot of folks that have come into the fandom because of these shows.

[00:12:31] But they're going back and watching these old series as well so I think if we went back to a that sort of storytelling that was a little bit less intense like you said the world isn't always about to end fans are still going to watch it we get that from lower dex even no one's complaining about the storylines in lower decks and we're not saving the galaxy there every week.

[00:12:50] I think Star Trek fans just want Star Trek and that's part of why today's news is so concerning is I think we were all expecting a cancellation followed by another big announcement here's the new series and there's nothing coming from that.

[00:13:03] But to answer your question guests I think Trek fans would go for that Mike yeah I mean Ron brings up lower decks but I mean strange new world has been talked about nationally as a huge hit for Paramount.

[00:13:18] And that has not I mean it's all of the production value on it is still very very high quality but the storyline like you were saying not galaxy ending the wrapping everything up at the end of the episode as far as the plot line for that particular episode.

[00:13:39] But they're also carrying on a season long storyline as well when it comes to characters so I think when it comes to that yeah people are definitely going to continue to buy in on the strange world side so if they were to tailor a series to the that type of development where.

[00:13:57] wrapping up the story but you're able to carry on a character plot line throughout the course of the season then yeah I think you'd still keep people engaged even those that weren't.

[00:14:08] Trek fans 35 years ago.

[00:14:11] I think that this squarely makes strange new worlds the flagship of the Star Trek franchise now on television with no movie on the horizon.

[00:14:22] I think it's safe to say and I'm sure you guys will agree that season three of strange new worlds is pretty much assumed at this point you know we had Anton Mountis captain pike on a super bowl ad.

[00:14:34] There's all kinds of new ads with him for paramount plus I'm inclined to believe that strange new worlds isn't going anywhere anytime soon do you guys both agree.

[00:14:46] Yeah I was thinking the exact same thing as you built with us with how Anton Mount was in the Super Bowl promotion it seems like even right from the start of them announcing the strange to world was going to be a thing.

[00:15:03] They had Ethan peck and Hanson mount in promotions in their discovery area uniforms right right you know they hadn't even come up with the with the new.

[00:15:13] Costuming yet but they were already using them as promotional tools so I think I think you're absolutely right that's the direction that they're going in now Ron just a moment ago you brought up the fact that there was no announcement of a forthcoming series with the cancellation of star Trek discovery.

[00:15:32] Are you of the opinion now that a rumored star fleet academy series is probably dead in the water or at least could be dead in the water.

[00:15:42] Oh not at all I think I think it's just a matter of timing I think we've got record wrapping up you get discovery wrapping up there's definitely going to be another series there has to you know for the star trek haters that are looking at this discovery announcement saying they're canceling it because it's not popular Alex Kertzmann still has his job as of tonight.

[00:16:00] I don't think we're seeing anything that saying the star trek isn't alive and well I think it's they might do a show that's a smaller budget discovery is just such a big show a star fleet academy show could be much smaller scale and scope in budget my point.

[00:16:16] Yeah I was going to say if you're if you're going with the premise of star fleet academy you can use I hate that I hate to use one of these phrases but you can use a younger no name cast who you're not going to have to pay as much money to be in a starring role on so right away you're cutting from the cost line there and then if you're if it's a star fleet academy based thing I mean.

[00:16:45] How many times are they going to be going out in a firefight and all kinds of stuff so you if you play your card right you can keep it on a whatever 2023 24 budget would be for a TV show.

[00:17:01] Yeah and I think that makes sense I personally don't think that we'll see an announcement of a star fleet academy show for quite some time you know if paramount is announcing you know sort of budget cuts you know colloquially let's call it that.

[00:17:15] I have a hard time believing they're going to green light a new series you know in the same week where they announced that they're trying to cut the spending on on original series.

[00:17:25] I think it could be a couple of years before we see a star fleet academy series personally although I like all of the other track that's come out I would watch the hell out of it because it's star trek and it's on TV and I love star trek so.

[00:17:39] And we joked a little bit earlier about section 31. I think that show is never going to happen I've been saying that now for two years do you guys think that section 31 is is ever going to see the light of day as a series Mike you first.

[00:17:56] No not really no you know there were some signs that kind of pointed in the direction at the end of season to a discovery that they were going to.

[00:18:04] That they were trying to make a way for it by taking a character that people like the national Tyler in making him the head of section 31.

[00:18:15] And then they gave everyone a little more of a hope when they had that nice send off from Michelle yo in season three right but those are the only two links that we've ever seen since the original announcement so as much as my daughter is going to be.

[00:18:34] I'm just going to say that I don't think that it's going to happen.

[00:18:39] I hate you for other reasons entirely let's be honest.

[00:18:42] Rod what do you think section 31 or is it going to happen or as has its time coming gone?

[00:18:48] I think if it's going to happen it's not going to happen in the way that we think it's going to happen.

[00:18:53] I don't see us getting a regular series with 10 episodes would Michelle yeah with the lead.

[00:18:58] So we're getting a section 31 show where she makes a guest appearance here and there or I've been wanting this more than thinking it's going to happen for years and that's give us a movie.

[00:19:09] You know Michelle how Oscar winner she's incredible put her on the big screen in a section 31 movie that allows for a large budget lots of special effects and can bring more people into the fold very interesting realistically probably not.

[00:19:23] Yeah I mean I would love I mean I'll watch anything that she's in because she's amazing and rightfully so.

[00:19:30] I wish we could have had more time with prime Philip a Georg you but things are what they are there.

[00:19:37] As we look to wrap this up any final thoughts on the announcement today about discovery Mike.

[00:19:45] Yes so the as we were just as Ron said we can possibly see a section for everyone just not in the way that we thought we might see it.

[00:19:57] I mean there was a big piece today on the ready room about the relationship between Michelle heard and Michael Dorn and how they got along so well.

[00:20:09] Yeah the card I mean maybe it's not section 31 per se maybe it's a small and nothing you don't have to be a series it could be actually just a single mini series on starfleet intelligence maybe since that's the work that they're doing here but who knows I mean that would still be big budget they're both.

[00:20:30] Big actors that we can be demanding a decent pay.

[00:20:35] Ron what about you final thoughts on this discovery news as we sort of wrap up our chat about it tonight.

[00:20:43] Second what Mike said and you know I bring back short tracks let's see some starfleet intelligence short tracks I think it's it's easy to look at the cancellation and say you know are we going back into that period in the 2000s where there is no star trek but when you sit back and realize we have a live vaccine strange new worlds with ants and mountain incredible cast.

[00:21:02] We have star trek prodigy we have lower decks star trek is very much still alive and well and it's we have three series on the air right now which is incredible so it's still a great time to be a trek you know I think we're still in that golden age of star trek.

[00:21:16] Yeah I'm inclined to agree with you both I I think that there still has never been a better time to be a star trek fan you know it's like this and next generation all good things must come to an end and discovery has let us on a wild ride and by the time it's.

[00:21:31] 65 episodes later.

[00:21:34] We're still enjoying the heck out of it and I can only hope that like you all said earlier that they give it a finale that's worthy of the series because it's it's it's re energized star trek and it's the least they can do for that cast so well anyway that's going to conclude our chat about the this cancellation of star trek discovery for Ron for Mike I am Bill Smith.

[00:21:57] This has been a special episode of discovering trek we do hope you all live long and prosper.